S. 1 Ep. 18 – What It Takes To Be A 7-Figure Speaker

Taylorr: Welcome to another episode of technically speaking, we are really excited about today’s guest award-winning speaker and leader in creativity and innovation, James Taylor. James, welcome to the show. My friend,

James: Well, what joy being with you. It’s like I feel so at home, I see the guitars on the wall. I feel like some fellow musicians I get to hang out with as well as talking about all this speaking stuff. 

Taylorr: Absolutely. We’re going to have to do maybe a jam session one of these days

James: A virtual session, yeah.

Taylorr: Yeah, let’ do it. So, for those of you listening, who don’t know who James is, James Taylor is an award-winning speaker and internationally recognized leader in creativity and innovation. For over 20 years, he has been teaching entrepreneurs, educators, corporate leaders, writers, and rock stars, how to build innovative organizations and design the creative life they desire. As the founder of C School and host of the Creative Life podcast and TV show, he’s taught thousands of individuals in over 120 countries through his online courses, books, videos, and keynote speeches. After advising some of the world’s most creative individuals and companies ranging from Grammy award winning music artists, and best-selling authors to Silicon Valley startups and innovative multinationals, James designed a framework for creativity that helps individuals and organizations achieve exponential growth. His clients have included Apple, Yamaha, Sony, and Johnson and Johnson, as well as high profile one-on-one coaching clients. 

As an in-demand creativity expert he has been featured in countless media outlets and was the subject of a 30-minute BBC documentary about his life and work. James is also a fellow of the Royal society of the arts whose fellows have included global innovators and leaders, including president Benjamin Franklin, Sir. Tim Berners-Lee, Bob Dylan, Adam Smith, Nelson Mandela, and professor Stephen Hawking. What a well decorated individual you are James? It is truly an honor to have you here on the show today.

James: I’m exhausted just hearing that. You could have done all these things, things manked up and add up and like, wow, sometimes you have to pause. Thank you so much for that lovely introduction.

Taylorr: You got it. One of my favorite questions to kick off these shows James, is how did you end up in this crazy world of speaking? What led you here and what has fueled what you do now?

James: So, my background is really predominant music from the music industry. My grandfather was a musician, he was a bass player, my father is a professional jazz musician, my wife is a professional jazz singer and musician so I come from the music industry really. And when I first left college, I managed a lot of artists and I worked with a lot of Grammy artists and platinum selling artists that help kind build their careers. Initially when I got started in just kind of going to college, I was playing drums, I’m a musician myself. I was kind of gigging on the weekends, working, managing artists, record labels, all that stuff. I then gradually over time, what happened was I ended up spending more time backstage behind the scenes. So, if you would go to a concert that may have thousands, tens of thousands of people in the audience for one of my artists, but I was usually the guy behind the stage or the wings of the stage. And I got very comfortable doing that and building other brands. 

And then I moved to California, my wife and I moved to Northern California. And we involved in creating lots of online music schools, online music academies. And that was great fun and that was my first move into the world of online, online education, online learning. And I loved that and I learned about online marketing as a result of that as well. But after a while, a number of people I was working with and clients, they were saying, listen could you give a talk, give a speech about the kind of stuff that you do. I had this kind of strange mix of always being around creative people in different areas and having a real passion for creativity. But also, being have this kind of tech thing kind of going on and having been very interested in innovation, artificial intelligence, machine learning, online marketing. And so that’s how I kind of initially came on to speak on stage. My first professional speaking engagement going back on-stage game was like 2017, I think it was and it felt like coming home. It felt like just coming back to somewhere that’s why I left this so long? But I think that happens in all of us. We have these things in the back of our heads, oh yeah, I’ll get around to that someday. And finally I just made the decision, okay, now now’s the time to go back on that stage.

Taylorr: Wow. 2017. Did I hear that right? 

James: Yeah, 2017.

Taylorr: Was it 2020 three years? 

James: Yeah. 

Taylorr: James, you’ve had explosive growth over those three years. What you attribute to that success?

James: I had a little bit of a secret weapon in that in my career, in the music industry, I often managed artists and artists brands and being an agent and I knew about things like SEO and stuff like that, PPC ads, so I had a little bit of a secret weapon there, I guess. But the probably the explosive growth right at the very start was probably for a couple of reasons. One is, I just thought I’m not going to half-ass this I’m just going to go all in on it and if it fails, it fails, it’s fine. Let’s see what happens. The other thing is I was very lucky, very early on to find a couple of very good mentors who just kind of advised me, I kind of knew the kind of speaking I wanted to do, so many different flavors and speaking world and I kind of sensed the kind of speaker that I wanted to become. And then I did this bizarre thing in 2016 before I got into speaking, we talking about guitars, my father is guitar player and I said, you know, what would be really cool? Why don’t we create one of these online summits? Online summits were just getting started at that point, and I created one called online guitar summit. 

I’m not a guitar player, I’m a drummer. But I interviewed all these amazing guitar players. And we put this out as an online summit. And it was really great because we’ve got 10,000 attendees at this online summit, learning about guitar and a real passionate community. And I thought, do you know what I’m going to do? I’m going to do an online summit. I don’t care if no one comes to it almost, but this will give me an opportunity to interview people that are really skilled in being speakers and to kind of decode, how did they build their speaking careers and there must be patterns I can probably spot over time. So, the very first time we did that 2017, I think it was the first year of International Speakers Summit is what I called it. And I think we had like 12,000, on that first year. 12,000 attendees, I interviewed 75 I think it, was speakers and it was like getting an MBA in professional speaking. I just learned so much all, different speakers from different backgrounds and I just started implementing what I was learning. That’s why I’m so passionate about online is like we’re living in this incredible time now that we can go online YouTube or attended online summit, learn these things and then just implement them and test experiment with them. So that was probably the reasons I was able to accelerate pretty quickly.

Austin: That is so cool for one thing. I had this old mentor of mine that used to say that luck is created when preparation meets opportunity. I see elements of that in your journey. You’ve had these different situational things arise that led to the ideas and then you went and executed on them and that’s turned into success for you. And I think it’s awesome, I think a lot of people hear a lot of good ideas, but I don’t know how many people actively pursue implementing those ideas, let’s say. I’d be curious to hear if you think that’s true for one thing and if so, why do you think you had the chops to implement these ideas and when others don’t,

James: I think it was probably naivety on my part, frankly.

Taylorr: Ignorance is bliss, right.

James: Ignorance. Absolutely. There’s a bravery there born of stupidity. Just because like, I don’t know if it’s going to fail, what’s going to happen, but you just kind of get into it and you try it and some things work, some things don’t. And I think you mentioned that, Austin, this idea of taking action and consistent action. Breaking down those big things that you may want to achieve and breaking them into lots of individual steps and like, okay, what am I doing today to make this happen? What am I doing this week? What am I doing this month? And just gradually breaking that down. Because we’re probably all attended those seminars, I’ve gone to conferences and you hear someone, a great speaker and they’ve all got some amazing information that you think I can apply that to what I do. And then you go away and you might forget about it or, if you go to a lot of big speaker conferences and I hear speakers up there, I’m often looking at the audience from my background as being in the business backstage. And I’m looking at the audience, I’m looking to see what are they reacting to? What are they taking? What are they writing notes that they’re going to do? I just think after, so many people just kind of put that notebook down and then they don’t do anything. Just take that one thing and just implement it and do it every day and just consistency.

Taylorr: Definitely. I’m curious from all of that learning that you did, and it’s such a cool story because we can really relate to this. We work with speakers at scale so we see what works, what doesn’t work, I know you see this with speakers, you as well, which probably fuels some of that. But what are some of those big takeaways that you learned from that first summit that you went out and implemented and then furthermore, saw success from?

James: I think there was a number of things really, probably someone like David Avrin that said very early on the speaker at the summit said, you know, the business of speaking isn’t, speaking is getting booked to speak, that’s really the business. And I noticed early on, there was a lot of very good speakers who go on stage perhaps, and maybe had really good ideas and good frameworks, but they just didn’t execute on the business side so well. They didn’t have a system to execute on the business. They would do a little bit here, then they would forget about it and do something else. So probably the consistency as a key part, but kind of going back to what you do as well, I also leveraged systems a lot. I’m a big proponent of automation and now we’re going to move into this next level of machine learning and AI and things, but even just like automation checklists, Because I’ve got a little bit of a team now and I’m writing SOP, Standard Operating Procedures for them, like, okay, do this, then do that, then do that, then do that. And then gradually over time you can automate a lot of those systems as well. 

One of the things learning from a lot of those speakers is I sensed early on a lot of them were very good at selling, they’re good at sales, a lot of speakers, but not good at marketing. And they’re just fundamentally different things. I don’t think I’m great at sales, I think I have some abilities within certain parts of marketing as well so I just focused a little bit more on that piece. And then how to create automated systems campaigns and then execute like a mad scientist in a laboratory, you go and you think, okay, you have a hypothesis, 50% of the time it’s going to fail. That’s okay. But you test it and then whatever works, you improve upon that and then throw away the other stuff. What most people don’t see as all the failures all the test that we’ve run, that like, well, that didn’t go well, that’s a waste of money, that was a waste of time, but it wasn’t really, we learned something from it. So, we’re always just carrying out those tests and I think being quite systematic like that, and I think this is what’s probably helped me as a coach and I coach a lot of speakers that I teach. I don’t just teach the big high-level stuff, which is important in the mindset, but actually teaching very, very tactical things in campaigns that they could almost just not quite drag and drop, but they can take those and then start to implement them in their careers as well. And that just gives you a little bit of confidence that you can test, get feedback from the market, iterate and just keep going.

Taylorr: Wow, I think I developed a little bit of a man crush. James, we talk about this all the time.

James: Yeah, this is geek stuff.

Taylorr: I know, I just cannot overstate how exciting it is that you just said that, especially the mad scientist thing, I draw that comparison all the time. I don’t know if you know those James, but my background is as a chemist actually.

James: Oh, I didn’t know that.

Taylorr: Fuel cells and nerdy stuff, right.

James: Yeah.

Taylorr: Long story short, my personality does not line up with lab rats though. More on that later. But yeah, it’s all about that iteration. You just test something, you see if it works, it doesn’t, that’s cool. We learn from it, we move on and we continue to iterate and you automate along the way the things that work as much as possible, you get your SOPs in place, your documentation. But it’s a conversation we feel like not a lot of people like to have, because the second you say you need to document your processes and automate your systems. It’s just glass over the eyes, [cross-talk 13:41] hard.

Taylorr: Some people don’t have that mindset going into, I think maybe because I spent a lot of time in technology so you’re always doing minimum viable products, agile sprints. So, I was very aware of that OKR, Objective and Key Results, I was focused on that. For those speakers who aren’t so much in that mind space, the way that I often explain it to them, because a lot of the people I coach as well, they might have an assistant for example, or maybe a partner that helps them in their business. And the way the reason I automate a lot of things in our business is all of my members of my team have all got young kids. They’re all members of my team are in their twenties pretty much and a lot of my members of my team are in the Philippines and they’ve got young kids, babies, some of them as well. I don’t want to give anyone a task that frankly can be automated that machines should be doing.

Because that’s time that gets end up taking away from their families and I don’t really want to do it. Why would you want to do that? So, if you come at it from more from the heart perspective, rather than the technical head, just come out from the perspective of, okay, if I do this, if I automate one task or these series of tasks that wins me back time that I can go and go out walking on hikes or go and do something else or read or listen to inspiring Ted Talks or whatever. So, it depends where your head’s coming out, I guess, but you need to give yourself some way of incentivizing yourself to think like that and be that more scientific way that you’re talking about.

Austin: I’m hearing you say this and I think that sometimes it’s fear that holds back people from going down this path too. Fear that you’re not going to be able to do it the right way or that it’s going to be too technical for somebody to be able to achieve. But I want to highlight something that you said earlier, which is the failures that go along with that. People have this idea of building a business and I think one of the more common visualizations that people use when they’re building a business is the idea of building a house where you have lay a foundation, then you put up the frames and the dry wall, and then you decorate, and you end up with the beautiful house, but I don’t know if that’s really the best visualization. And one that I like to think of sometimes is a business starts out as a giant ugly chunk of ice and rather than you turning it into something beautiful by molding it and crafting it, you’re chiseling the way, the stuff that you don’t need. If we’re looking at our own businesses, we already start with the concept of a business and really, it’s our job to just try things and experiment and take action and we’re going to fail a lot along the way and that’s just us chiseling away the ice. And if you fail enough times and you remove enough of the stuff that you know, doesn’t work, you end up with the beautiful sculpture and something that has value. But it starts with action, and not being afraid of the consequences, just going out there and doing your best and then reacting appropriate.

James: Yeah. And on the kind of music analogy as well, my background initially was as a jazz drummer, that was my kind of style of playing. And with jazz there’s quite a lot of technique that has to be involved in jazz, but it has certain forms so there’s not total chaos. It might sound like chaos at times, but it’s not chaos. But you’re always trying, you’re improvising, you’re seeing what’s working. And sometimes in fact, very often you will put yourself down dark alleys on purpose, not having no way that you know how you’re going to get out of it, but you have to figure something else out. And also, like jazz it’s most enjoyable when you’re working with other people and you’re playing with other people and you’re bouncing off their ideas. 

You can do it on your own. And this is obviously the value with having maybe mentors or having a mastermind group or being member of our speaker’s association, or just having a tribe of other speakers, having people like yourself involved and helping just that you can bounce those ideas. Like, what if we did this? I wonder what that would do. And taking ego out of it a little bit and just say treating it that like that musician or that scientist, that’s going to try something and it may work. In jazz they say, if you make a mistake, all you have to do is just make mistake again, then they call it jazz anyway so it’s, it’s fine. It’s okay. And we’re not doing brain surgery here, we’re just trying different things. And as long you just get comfortable with that, that 50% of it is going to fail and that’s okay.

Taylorr: As a creativity expert, is that part of your process for helping coax creativity out of people is by putting them in groups where they can bounce ideas around? Is that a strategy that you would employ as a creativity expert?

James: Yeah, it on the group. There’s a concept called psychological safety that Professor Amy Edmondson really developed, which is this idea that in a group you do need a certain level of trust in a group to be able to relate if you’re doing brainstorming, for example. You want to have that level of trust that you can say things and you can come back. But also, once you build that trust there’s a level above that, which probably is best exemplified by companies like Pixar, where they have a thing that I think is called the brain trust. Where on a Thursday, they get together, they review all the work the previous day, and they’re ruthless. They are ruthless on it. They love each other and they support each other as a group, but they’re not willing to let anything slide and they’re going to hold you to a higher standard. And I know people that have been in that room and it can be, you have to go home and have a lie down afterwards. But the reason is everyone’s trying to do the same thing. Everyone’s trying to raise the quality of the work and improve you.

So I think it depends on your stage of the journey. If you’re going from the old style of you talking about the carpenter that’s chiseling the ice, you go from apprentice to journeyman, to master traditionally. And so, there’s one level of techniques and creativity you’ll often use at those early stages just to build a bit of confidence, psychological safety, but then there’s other ones. If I’m working with someone who’s the real master on something you could be a little bit more maybe aggressive. Let’s put it that way, and be a bit more… in Scotland we have this expression, we call it flighting, which is the ritual abuse of your opponent by means of verbal violence. And it’s basically like, just like when you’re a with a friend with a good friend, they want to see what’s best for you, but they’re also not going to let you off the hook as well. They’re going to challenge you on things. And so, I think that when you get to that level, you want those people around you and you want those peers around you that will call you out sometimes and say, you really think that’s true. I don’t think so.

Austin: That makes sense to me. In any partnership, you don’t want somebody that just constantly agrees with you or goes with the flow. You want somebody to contend with, that’s going to challenge your ideas and make you better. So that makes sense to me.

Taylorr: We have a lot of that going on. Don’t we, Austin? 

Austin: Yeah. Sometimes

James: I see it so many times from companies. I was doing an event recently for a company called Globant, a Latin American tech firm, and it was myself and Steve Wozniak, the keynote speakers on it. And I was talking with Steve Wozniak as part of this whole thing and we were talking about music and we talking all kinds of stuff. But he was very much the geek in that relationship with Steve Jobs. He was the one that was burying himself, building the Apple Two and building all that stuff where Steve Jobs was a visionary in a different way. But that combination of the two of them, we see so many times they call it creative payors in creativity training. Lennon, and McCartney, Steve Jobs and Wozniak, Pablo Picasso and George Braque, you see so many times these two opposites they can come together and create something amazing.

Taylorr: Definitely. There’s a common business framework that we use here at Speaker Flow, James you may have heard of it. It’s called ELS by Gino Wickman, actually out of Minnesota, the entrepreneurial operating system. But they call this pair the visionary and the integrator, basically of a company where there are two generally different types of visionaries. One who is tremendously able to get all the business systems and operating procedures and the technical kind of bits together, much like you outlined and then you have the visionary, the ideas, and there’s a checks and balances system between the two. So, definitely relate to that. It appears everywhere from business to creative pairs and kind of everything you outlined. It’s finding those duos, which further emphasizes the importance of getting a team around you and getting exposure to people who can help you facilitate your growth.

And, you know, we’re here to talk about what it takes to, to be a seven-figure speaker. And I know James, you may fall into this category and you may have helped people who also fall into this category. What are some of those common traits that you find in speakers who are able to grow a seven-figure business? I think sometimes when we talk with speakers about being able to get to this level, they often draw the dots to speaking is what gets seven figures, whereas speaking can be a means to generate more revenue. What are the general types of business models you’re seeing from professional speakers and thought leaders to hit that seven-figure milestone, so to speak?

James: So I think one thing is, you’ll see, as you mentioned it just before there, team. There’s very rare that you’ll see someone that’s doing seven figures and above if they don’t have a team. Even if it’s one other person or contractors. At that level, they usually have to have a team. I see it sometimes where you’ll see a seven-figure speaker and it might be, she might be the speaker and she might have a partner or an assistant, like one person. But they’re amazing, real rock stars or what they do. They’re very skilled in what they do and then they’ll use contractors around them. That’s quite common. I think what is probably more common is just having multiple streams of income. You mentioned speaking is really one of those levels. I talk about this thing as 10 different income streams for speakers.

There’s probably a lot more than that, but there’s usually 10 are the main ones. You don’t have to have old 10 but you probably want to have three or four really to get to that level. The common one for speakers is the speaking as the keynote or the speaking that you’re doing and you have a limited inventory for that. That’s you, and it’s a little bit easier now with virtual, because you can, theory you can do two or three keynotes in a day so that’s a little bit easier, but that’s really just about profitability. That’s very good for profitability. It doesn’t create some ongoing revenue stream. Just the period of history that we’re going through just now, like happened in 2001 and 97…

Taylorr: 2008

James: Things drop off a clip and suddenly, you’ve got speakers sleeping in their cars very quickly. You don’t want to be in that position. I talk about these 10 different income streams, but I also talk about getting the balance right between a different income streams. And I talk about this idea of the all-weather speaker, and this comes from work by Ray Dalio, the great Hedge Fund investor who has I thing called the All-Weather Fund, which basically is a way of asset allocation that regardless of whether the market goes up or down, your money increases the value of your assets increase. And that has really got to do with asset allocation. So, if we think about speaking the keynote speaking, the bit of you going up on a stage in personal virtual, I would still argue it shouldn’t be more than 40% of your overall revenue because it’s very spiky. Something Phil M Jones talks about is the cherry on the top, he often thinks about it in relation to his other business. 

So that’s very good. You go for profitability, it’s great for lifestyle, it’s great for branding positioning, it’s wonderful for that, but then you need some other things around that as well. Often very common speakers they will have some type of a train the trainer type of model. Not every speaker has that, but a lot of them do. So that could be in form of online courses is one type of thing, which is still individual sales that you’re making or group sales. But if you add a train the trainer, so you have other people that go and deliver that training or workshop, then you start to scale it a little bit more. So that’s good, that’s better. But the key thing, if you really want to have something to balance up the spikiness of your keynote income is residuals, is a membership subscription, however you want to call it. It’s so important to have something in that, to be able to do that. For some speakers that could be like me, for example, with SpeakersU, I could have sold all these courses on SpeakersU as individual courses, but that felt like a lot of work. So, I just sell a membership and people can join, there’s different levels of membership, and they can just take the online training on its own, watch all the courses, or they can have the version, which includes one-on-one coaching with me. But it’s a membership, people pay monthly or annually and it re recurring so that adds a lot of nice things for the cashflow as well. 

Some other speakers they’ve got much higher priced things there as well. They might have maybe more ongoing coaching, but once you in coaching, it starts to get a little bit into requires you to be there all the time. So, you want to try and balance some stuff up there as well. So, you’ve got high income profitability speaking subscription, hard to get started slow at the start, but you reach certain inflection points. Your first hundred members, then 500 members and I’ve seen this because I’ve now been involved in 40 membership programs of myself and other people, other experts, and you just see these natural things. And then around that, you add other things could be high level seminars, my coaching, consulting, books, which don’t necessarily generate much income on their own, but they’re a low risk-based way of creating intellectual property. So, these are just some of the main ways and what you find with seven figure speakers is they’re going to have two or three of this. Someone like Chad Hymas is a great speaker. He’s speaks on safety. I think he’s got eight, the last time I spoke to him and `he’s going to be up there, you know, and some of it probably just 30% comes actually from his speaking on stages.

Austin: Wow. 

Taylorr: Makes perfect sense. Diversification is the common lingo; the average millionaire has what seven different streams of income or something to that effect. Definitely more than one or two and then you step into three and four and so on. I think you highlighted something important in that conversation just a moment ago where it can be slow to start. And it takes iteration and patience and then really working it to get to those inflection points. One of the things that we see a lot of the time is we’ll create something. A speaker will want to create something, a membership site, an online course, and they create it and then boom, it’s created. And then we don’t wait long enough to get to those different inflection points and before you know it, they’re off creating something else. And then another thing we ended up with a bunch of kind of different things that were created, but never any that were executed or focused on entirely to kind of reach those inflection points. How do you help somebody stick with it long enough to actually see those results?

James: There’s a way that I think you can do and this is certainly way that, and I just speak here from personal experience. I also have a lot of different interests in different things. The way that I’ve been able to figure out like with speaking, I thought, oh, well, I could do training on the craft of speaking generally, and 40 people don’t place a high monetary value on that, even though it’s the thing that’s going to get you booked best is if you give a great speech, but people don’t place a high value on it. They’re more willing to pay, put high value on the marketing or the selling aspects and I I’m fascinated by those as well, but I’m also fascinated by the real profitability side or the geeky side. How to build a team, building will that leverage. I have all these interests; you can put them all into the world of speaking and I just put them all within the membership. So, if I get an idea for an online course, like the other day one of my members was saying he’s launching a whole thing around some on online courses and I’ve done a lot of online courses. 

I said, well, do you know what I’m going to create a 20-video course on how to do online courses of everything that I know about how to market them, how to position them, how to create them, all those things and I just put it inside the membership I don’t have to sell it as a separate product again. So, if you can create whether it’s, I see other people doing this, Victor Antonio is a speaker on sales. He has a program; he just keeps putting more things and more related to sales into that program. Someone like Grunt Cado would probably do the same thing in sales as well. And you can have all these different things, as long as they kind of have a general relation to something and they’re serving the same audience, then you can put it in rather than trying to sell individual hallo cart courses. That’s the way I would go for it. You can really invest your time and your creativity in thinking about how best to market it, rather than having to build entirely new thing from scratch every time.

Taylorr: That’s a great piece of advice and I love that conversation you just had about what it takes to be a seven-figure speaker. We’ve talked a little bit about it, we’ve got the systems, got the diversification, the system supported a team around you. None of this if we look back in the history of time really is a new, it’s just the mediums in which that we acquire all of those things just kind of change. That’s really what it takes to be a seven-figure speaker. Thanks so much for sharing your wisdom here today, James. Now as you know, that’s why you’re here today, we’re all about creating value for our audience. What are some of the things you’re working on right now that our listeners can benefit from?

James: If anyone’s listening, watching this just now, and they’re interested in this idea about becoming a seven figure speaker, maybe they’re already a seven figure speaker, they’re watching listening to this and they just want to add maybe another interesting revenue stream to what they do, or maybe they’re a fast rising speaker and they want to see how this stuff works, or maybe you’re just getting started and you want you decide to between which of these different revenue streams are right for you and your personality as an expert, as a thought leader, then we actually have a training at SpeakerU, a free training is called a Seven Figure Speaker blueprint. And I’m sure we’ll put a link here, but you could go to speakersu.com, they also find that in the top part. And that’s great. And if you want a little bit more, if you want a lot of expertise, lots of different types of speakers, then we also have internationalspeakerssummit.com and you can go there and also get a free pass for that.

Taylorr: Perfect. Well, thanks for sharing all of those resources, James. For all of you listeners, those will be in the show notes and description below. And hey, if you found this episode valuable, don’t forget to rate subscribe, and if you want more awesome resources like this, go to speaker flow.com/resources. Thank you so much for chiming in. I just wanted to take a second to thank our sponsor Auxbus. Auxbus is the all in one of suite of tools you need to run your podcast. And it’s actually what we run here at Speaker Flow for Technically Speaking. It makes planning podcast simple; It makes recording podcasts simple; it even makes publishing podcasts to the masses simple and quite honestly, Technically Speaking, wouldn’t be up as soon as it is without Auxbus. Thank you so much Auxbus. And if you are interested in checking Auxbus out, whether you’re starting a podcast or you have one currently get our special offer auxbus.com/speaker flow, or click the link below in our show notes.