S. 2 Ep. 47 – The Similarities Of Speaking To 100 vs. 100,000

Austin: Aha.

Taylorr: Wow, pretty good. We’re okay?

Austin: We did it. Okay.

Taylorr: Man, great show, look at us go.

Austin: A little human moment for everybody listening right now. Because we get told all the time, like, oh, easy for you to say automation, because you’re the, we just struggled for five minutes to get this episode live, everybody.

Taylorr: Holy crap.

Austin: But we’re here now and we’re here with Ronny. Ronny, thank you so much for being here today, it’s a privilege to have you.

Ronny: Thank you very much. Thank you, Austin. Thank you, Taylorr. To both of you, thank you for having me. And also, thank you for everybody listening. It’s going to be worthwhile your time.

Austin: Good. Oh, man. And from Austria, nonetheless.

Taylorr: Yes.

Austin: It’s a beautiful thing in 2022 that we can have a live conversation, more or less face-to-face from, literally, opposite ends of the planet. It’s.

Taylorr: Beautiful thing.

Austin: Pretty awesome. Yeah.

Ronny: Incredible. I love it.

Austin: Yeah, us too. All right. Well, we’re so excited to have this episode. As our listeners know, we love to do some digging behind the scenes and find something interesting to, sort of, learn more about you. And you have a very interesting backstory, just full stop, so we could start anywhere. But one of the things that, really, stood out to us was, first of all, just this love of sports that you have. I see you’ve run a couple of marathons, which is inspiring to me, because I’m also training for a marathon, my first one ever. 

So, thank you for the inspiration there. Taylorr’s a big weightlifter, we’re sports fans too. But we saw that you were a national competitor or champion even for fist ball. And the question that we have is, what the hell is fist ball?

Ronny: Well, national champion, yes, with our school back then. So, I was 14 years old, and we were, of course, in our age range, but what is fist ball? You know what volleyball is, I guess.

Taylorr: Yeah.

Austin: Yeah.

Ronny: Yeah. And fist ball is a bit similar, although, you do not have a net, you have a line and at the same time, you’re not allowed to open your fist. So, you need to play with your fist, either you can hit the ball with the fist on the side like a smash or you hit it with your lower arm, basically. And the ball can touch the ground between every player, in a way.

Austin: Oh, wow.

Taylorr: Fascinating. Wow.

Austin: So, if the ball can touch the ground, how do you get a point or something?

Ronny: Okay. It can touch the ground once. So, if it touches the ground more than once then it’s a point.

Austin: Interesting.

Taylorr: Wow. Fun.

Ronny: Thanks for the clarification.

Taylorr: Yeah.

Austin: I want to try it, that sounds awesome.

Taylorr: I know, for real. Yeah, I might just start a league here.

Ronny: It was fun.

Taylorr: Yeah. That’s rad. Well, man, holy cow. On top of fist ball, you are, also what we read is, one of just over a hundred Tony Robbins trainers, is that right?

Ronny: Exactly. No fist balling here.

Taylorr: I didn’t even know he had a training program. That’s crazy.

Ronny: What’s that?

Taylorr: I said I didn’t even know he had trainers. This is the first time I read about it, how did that all come to be?

Ronny: Well, actually, I’ve been in a Tony Robbins environment for more than half of my life. So, 2001 was my first Tony Robbins event that I went to, and maybe the one or other of the people who are listening right now have been to a Tony Robbins event. And there are huge seminars all over the world that he’s doing. And, well, when I went there and, of course, basically, it’s all about for you, as a participant, to get the most out of your life in different areas, depending on the seminar that you’re at. 

It’s about creating breakthroughs, creating wows, but he cannot do that alone because nowadays we have seminars or we had seminars before COVID, for example, in the United Center where the Chicago Bulls play or in the San Jose Sharks arena in San Jose or in the American Airlines Center in Miami where the Miami Heat play and so on. So, it’s, really, huge stadiums and he cannot do this all alone, so there are trainers there who also help and support and who also serve the participants. 

There are also some other events, maybe, one or the other person has watched, I’m Not Your Guru on Netflix, that Tony Robbins documentary. And that’s his date with destiny program, that’s the name of the program. And there are also trainers who lead a team. So, basically, every team has a trainer and I’m one of those.

Austin: Wow. So, you’re, actually, onsite working with Tony to help these attendees get the breakthroughs that they’re there for. Did I do that right?

Ronny: Exactly. Yeah.

Austin: Wow. That’s incredible. Do you do breakout sessions where you’re in small groups doing, actual, training, are you doing more individual stuff and helping people along the way? Is it a mix?

Ronny: All of it. So, one of the things is in a team, every morning we have a team meeting, for example, and, of course, we are there for a team and now we have all of that virtual and every virtual zoom room, so to say, and there might be 30,000 participants. But they’re going to be in different zoom rooms because one zoom room is not going to hold 30,000 people. And so, every room is going to have a trainer as well. And so, it’s, really, about holding the room, being there for them, you’re, basically, the person responsible that the participant is being served. And on the other hand, if one of them has a breakdown or a challenge or something, then also it’s up to a trainer to work with that person one-on-one.

Austin: Wow.

Taylorr: Wow.

Austin: Man, that’s such a cool model.

Taylorr: The scale of all of that is.

Austin: I know.

Taylorr: Mind-blowing.

Austin: Gosh. Seems like the logistics have to be just intense, trying to get that many people to get the value that they’re there for and just keep everything moving. Especially, virtually, trying to run 30,000 people through zoom rooms, my heart gets palpitations just thinking about it.

Taylorr: For sure.

Ronny: No, it’s, really, incredible. And to everybody who is also in the speaking industry, and this is, basically, probably, a lot of our listeners are going to be in the industry. Things have changed in the last two years, a lot. And just being on the forefront and in a trailblazing site of that, of what’s, actually, happening and going on and having seen that from, basically, being shut down to now being up and running, basically, all around the world at the same time in different time zones. 

So, people might start, actually, a seminar at eleven o’clock at night and go until the next day at noon or other people are going to start, maybe, in the later afternoon and go until the morning and other people start in their morning and go until the evening. That’s, usually, the US, but yeah.

Austin: Oh, man. So, that means that if you’re in Austria, unless you’re here in the States onsite, I imagine you’re, probably, working through the night sometimes for those events.

Ronny: Exactly. There are events where I start, maybe, at 1:30 or two o’clock in the afternoon, and then, I end at well, let’s see, eight o’clock, 8:30, nine o’clock in the morning.

Taylorr: Oh my, I thought you were going to say night for a second. The morning, oh my goodness.

Ronny: Yeah.

Taylorr: Ronnie, what a champion. Holy cow.

Austin: Yeah.

Taylorr: Well, it looks like too, based on your history, you’re not immune to being in front of a lot of people. It’s incredible; seriously, go check out Ronny’s about page, you guys, the link will be in the show notes, but massive audiences. You spent what, 1500 hours on live TV, you’ve also done stadium shows and giant events, how did that all come to be? Did you always know you wanted to be in front of large audiences? What was the journey to get into that world?

Ronny: Well, actually, it was never, who does that?

Taylorr: Ah, this is what I want to do. Yeah.

Ronny: No, it was like, who does that? How do you get that? It was not like, yeah, I want to become a host or a presenter or something at events or a stadium announcer, or a ring announcer at boxing events. It was not like, yeah, that’s what I want to do. I studied sports and economics, really, actually, economics was my first study, and then, I also studied sports just as a hobby; not even thinking that I was going to be doing something around that field. And then, when I was getting done with my studies, that was in 2008, I was asking myself, well, okay, awesome, now you’re getting done, but what do you want to do now? 

Because before that, I was always working in different fields, in different areas, I was working a few years in sales; I learned quite a few things in that area. Then I wanted to pass on my knowledge, so I was working a few years in teaching people. So, in education, for example, three, four years, I was educating unemployed people on everything, from sales to purchasing. But, at the same time also, how do you apply somewhere? But I knew that was not the end. I knew, okay, what now? And then, I thought, well, I would love to do something that I’m passionate about. 

Not just something that I’m interested about, but something where I, really, have the passion for. I thought that’s a great concept, because if you’re passionate about something, then you’re going to be good at it, or you’re going to become good at it very easily. Because it’s something that you just love to do without like, oh, I don’t want to do it anymore or is it Friday yet or whatever. So, it’s, really, like, this is what you love to do, this is what you were born to be. Well, the only challenge I had was, what is it?

Austin: Yeah. How do you identify that?

Ronny: What is that, that you’re passionate about? Because oftentimes, I hear people tell me like, oh, yeah, I want to do that, but I don’t know what it is. And I didn’t know what it is either. And so, I was asking myself the same questions over and over and over again. I was asking myself, what is it that I love to do in my free time? What is it that, actually, where I pay money for? What is it that, kind of, gets me emotionally, or that, really, moves me emotionally? What is it that I talk with my friends about? What is it that already, as a little kid, which I was passionate about, that I loved? 

And it always came back to the same thing. It always came back to, even when I was a little kid, I was always passionate about events that bring the whole world together, like the Olympic games or the soccer world cup, or if you’re not into sports, if you go to a concert, for example, of your favorite band or musician. When you’re there, you’re not thinking about, man, tomorrow I have to go to the hairdresser, or I need to send a text message. You’re, totally, there. You’re, totally, in it. 

And I knew that was something that I want to work in. I didn’t know yet what I, actually, wanted to do in that field, but I knew that this was the field that I want to be in. And then, the whole thought process, actually, was evolving around that. And the next step was, then, also at that time, from one of our professional soccer teams here in Vienna, their youth teams were looking for a stadium announcer for their under 17-year-olds and under 19 year olds. And since I knew some of their coaches from sports university, they were, actually, recommending me and saying, hey, you want to do it. And I was like, sure, why not? 

And so, once a month on a Saturday afternoon, I was, basically, hosting two games, playing some music, announcing the players, announcing some goal scores, just having fun for a hundred, 150 people. Not a lot of people, it was just, also not a lot of money that I got paid for it. I got 70 Euros.

Austin: Wow.

Ronny: Basically, 70 bucks. Yeah.

Taylorr: Yeah.

Ronny: And I thought, man, I, really, hit it big.

Austin: I did it.

Ronny: It was not about the money. It was just like, hey, I got the invitation for the Christmas party and I got season tickets for the big team. So, that was like, yay. That was already the coolest thing about it. But one year later in 2009, it was the 25th of June 2009; it was the day that Michael Jackson died. I was on that evening at a party of the sports university. And when I left at 5:15 in the morning, I remember to this day that a friend of mine who worked at the professional ice hockey team, she left as well. 

And 5:15 in the morning, the sun was up, and we came off, it was on a boat; we came off the boat and I was like, Hey, are you by any chance looking for a new stadium announcer for the ice hockey team. And she was, I have no idea, but I’ll ask. She calls me the next day, you know what? We’re looking for a stadium announcer. And I said, oh, wow that’s cool. Then a few meetings with the manager later, he said, okay, you’ll get your chance. And guess what? My first ever match that I saw live of that team, I was hosting it and playing the music.

 It was a total Hail Mary, basically, if you want to use football terms. It was either you learn very fast or you’re out. But that was the first time I, actually, for myself, I had made the decision, this is what I want to do. I love doing that and I want to grow in that area. I knew that there were a lot of things that I need to grow, but still there was something like, all right, the first thing I did was I invested all of the money from my first year for speakers’ education. And that’s how it started.

Austin: Wow.

Taylorr: Oh, man.

Austin: I love that, you just full-send, just went for it, make the ask and you never know what’s going to come if you just make the ask. And you, kind of, got what you were looking for there, which is great. I also can’t even imagine the nerves that maybe you were feeling when you were doing that first game without having experienced that before, or maybe that’s a false assumption on my part. Was it as easy for you as maybe it is now? Or were there a bunch of nerves attached to it?

Ronny: Well, it was not a hundred, 150 people anymore; it was, suddenly, several thousand people that were in the arena. And there was an existing fan base. And if you’ve ever seen any European sports, in US sports, usually, that the entertainment comes from the organization and it’s for the fans. In Europe, oftentimes, the fans are the entertainment, in a way. You’re still going to have some entertainment, but the fans bring their own, the chants and that like, they do a lot of stuff by themselves, and you need to, kind of, organize with them, in a way, to succeed. 

Because if you don’t have them behind you, it’s not going to work. And that, actually, ties back to when you’re speaking in front of an audience; you always need to know who is your audience? Who is it that you’re, actually, talking to? Because it’s all about their needs, it’s about fulfilling their needs, not your own needs. You are there to serve their needs, and so I was meeting with them several times before the season opened, with the fan clubs. And then, it was like, okay, let’s see how this is going to go, I was enthusiastic about it and not very knowledgeable, but I was willing to learn. And I think that’s the attitude you need to bring, because if you’re not willing to learn, man, it’s going to go one way. Downhill.

Taylorr: That’s right.

Austin: Right. Unless you get lucky.

Taylorr: Stagnancy.

Austin: Most people don’t, though. So, don’t bet on luck.

Taylorr: Yeah, for sure.

Austin: I’m also intrigued by you said that you started by going and getting a speaker education. Can you tell us more about that? What does that mean?

Ronny: Well, it was like a voice educational, a way as well, but, really, for 14 months, it was called a school of speaking. So, it was, really, about training your voice and how to speak and how to articulate something. You learn how to use your voice as an instrument. How do you put an emphasis on something? Where do you make a break that is logical? Also, how is the melody that you’re going to put into that resonates with somebody else? And also, you learn if you just change the tonality of a syllable, it might change the whole meaning of a sentence. 

If you’re speaking from stage and the voice is your instrument, the better you’re able to use your voice, the better you’re going to be able to influence your audience and you want to influence them in a positive way, in a good way.

Taylorr: Yeah.

Austin: Man, that’s so cool. I didn’t even know that kind of, organization existed. There are courses and you can go take a webinar series, and I know there is public speaking curriculum in some universities and stuff, but it, kind of, makes sense that, just the way that you said it right there, it’s similar to music. The nuance and how you play the music is how it impacts the audience, it’s what they feel. It’s not just about the notes; it’s how you play them. And so, similar to that, it sounds like with your voice, it’s not just the words themselves, but it’s the way that they’re delivered that makes the impact.

Ronny: It’s a lot more, actually, the way that they are delivered, that makes the impact, because think about it. You can hear the coolest thing in the world in terms of the content, but if it’s, totally, dry, monotonous and so on, you’re going to be fading off. But it can be some crazy stuff or some not so interesting stuff, but if the person who delivers it is, really, fun or engaging, or you’re totally drawn into it, you’re going to pay attention and you might even have fun. And having fun and getting the emotions involved has a lot to do with how you present something, not what you present.

Taylorr: Yeah, for sure. Wow. Super insightful. So, something that I’ve just been thinking about, especially as we were prepping for the show, learning about your background is, getting in front of thousands, tens of thousands, if not millions of people, especially, with your TV background. Does the performance change based on the size of the audience, do you find that it’s different presenting, engaging the masses versus let’s say a smaller group of people?

Ronny: Yes and no.

Taylorr: Okay.

Ronny: In general, the performance is always going to change, but it’s not so much about the audience. It’s not so much about the size of the audience, but about who is your audience.

Taylorr: Okay.

Ronny: And what is this about, what is the event about? So, basically, since I also do a lot of sports, you have to have a different performance. If you’re a ring announcer in boxing and standing in a ring and introducing some players, in the red corner and in the blue corner, and so on; it’s going to be very different than when you are, basically, presenting or having an interview on TV, for example, when you’re introducing somebody. Or also, even when you stay in a world of sports, every different sport has a different identity. 

And if you’re speaking at an event, it’s really, really, really imminent that you know what is the outcome of the event? And also, who is the audience? Who am I talking to? Because if you go somewhere and you are like, I know everything, I’m just going to tell the world, and they’re going to be [ought – 19:55], and I don’t care who it is. People don’t care how much you know until they know how much you care. 

So, your performance, it’s going to be depending on your audience. One more thing, as you were saying in terms of size of the audience, what, of course, can be that there is, sort of, a threshold in your mind, like with Luke and Yoda in Star Wars. Where it was like, well, moving stones around is one thing, but this is totally different when it was about to move the ship.

Taylorr: Yeah.

Ronny: And Yoda said, no different it is, only different in your mind. And so, also, it’s the same thing if you’re talking in front of 5 people, 50 people or 50,000 people at a time. You need to bring the energy.

Austin: That’s a good correlation.

Taylorr: Yeah.

Ronny: It’s about you resonating with somebody else, and you’re not talking to 50,000 people at the same time. You’re talking one-to-one times 50,000.

Taylorr: Whoa. That’s a cool perspective. Wow. Well, first off, hats off to the analogy to Star Wars. Super awesome, that, really, clicked with me; I don’t know about you listeners out there. So, that, really, landed. But, yeah, the shift of one-to-one times 50,000, I have never thought about it that way, that was paradigm shifting for me, Ronny.

Austin: True. One of my favorite public speaking figures, controversial figure, I will say, is Jordan Peterson. Jordan Peterson talks about how when you’re talking to a big audience, you’re still engaging with the audience and getting feedback from them, but it’s through different mediums. If you make eye contact with people, their demeanor will tell you about whether they’re locked in and interested or bored, or if they’re excited or if they’re fidgeting and talking to their neighbors or looking at their phone, you’re getting constant feedback. You’re just looking at different signals for that feedback, relative to a small audience where you have people raise their hand and tell you what they’re thinking. 

So, do you find that that’s true or are you just looking for different things in the audience to be able to give that one-to-one feeling, even if, maybe, you’re not having a two-way conversation with an individual?

Ronny: Well, if it’s possible and if the size of the people, actually, allows it; dare to ask, dare to ask your audience, dare to engage them directly, dare to address them directly. Because you’re going to get some feedback, if it’s just 5 or 50 people, it’s going to be very easy to ask them one-on-one, or to, really, look them in the eye and say something. If you’re in a stadium in front of 50,000 people, your engagement is going to look different. But still, I’m going to ask the audience, I’m going to ask them, where are the fans of whatever, of whoever the team is and so on, but I’m going to say it with certainty, like I mean it. Because here’s the thing. Does any one of you have pets or a dog?

Austin: Yeah. Both of us.

Ronny: Yeah. And a dog, they can feel if you’re certain, if you’re scared, if you’re fearful, whatever it is, they can feel how you are. And when you’re in a stadium and you have hundreds or tens of thousands of people looking at you. It’s like a wild beast, in a way; they can feel if you are certain, they can feel if you take direction, if you take command or if you’re fearful, they can feel that. So, you need to connect with your inner certainty, you need to connect with your own certainty, and if you’re like, Jesus, I’m freaked out of my mind. 

Before you go out there, think about a time where you felt completely certain, where you, totally, were there; really, get yourself in a space, connect with that space before you go out there and talk with them. That you can deliver from a, totally, different perspective than when you go out there like, oh my God, oh my God, Oh my God, I’m freaking out. Oh my God, I don’t know what to say, I’m, totally, blank. You don’t want to go there. Breathe deep, connect, and then, go out and speak.

Austin: Man, I love that. Internal work right there.

Taylorr: Internal work, that’s right. Yeah.

Austin: Yeah.

Taylorr: Man, holy cow.

Austin: What about some of the other preparation tactics that you might use? I’d be interested to hear too, if it’s different for a smaller audience than a bigger audience, as well, since you have such good expertise in both areas. But that’s one awesome thing that you just described, is getting into that proper headspace before you get out there, but what are some of the other things that you do before a big performance that you use to feel confident going into it?

Ronny: I’m going to take one thing that I just said before, and then, tie-it into the preparation, because you were saying about internally, to prepare internally. Yes. You prepare yourself internally so that you can show up and be completely externally, because when you are out there with an audience, no matter what the size is, you want to be present. You need to feel them, you need to see where they’re at, that means your focus is not in your own mind, in your head. Your focus should be with them. It should be, really, with them to take them on a journey, to take them on an experience, on an emotional experience. 

Basically, you want to know where you want to take them, I’ll give an example. When we have the Austria national team in soccer, and for the last 12 years, I’ve been doing the Austrian cup final in soccer, but also the national team games. And before we, actually, started working together, we were thinking about the process, we were thinking, well, okay, what is our outcome? And that’s, actually, also tying back into every [round – 25:57]. What is your outcome? What is it that you want to achieve? Also, what is it that the person who hires you to speak wants to achieve? 

So, first step, what is the outcome? And, of course, our outcome in the entertainment was, well, okay, our outcome is we got from doors open to kickoff, it’s two hours. That means our outcome is to have the fans on fire by the time the ball kicks off. So, we have the two hours to build the emotional bridge, to build it there. It’s not going to be that they are already on fire, maybe, but you still want to get them there, you want to heat it up. Then, the second question I always ask is who is my audience? Who is it? Who is it that I’m, actually, talking to? And before we came on the podcast here? I asked you, exactly, those two things.

Taylorr: Right?

Ronny: What’s the outcome? And also, who is the target audience.

Taylorr: Wow.

Ronny: And so, I want to know everything I can about the audience. For example, with the soccer example again, or with the sports example, I want to know who are those people? What is going on inside of them? What is their emotional involvement? Why are they here? Where were they before? Are they coming from the office? Are they, maybe, here because they have to be there? Or are they there because they love it? And once again, think about the stadium experience. Are they there? What’s going on today? Is this going to be a big game or is this going to be a game that doesn’t matter? Is it going to be a Super Bowl or is it going to be preseason? 

And it’s going to be quite different how people show up. If your team is in a Super Bowl, you’re going to be super hype for two weeks since you know that they’re in the Super Bowl. You’re going to be, basically, on the playoff train like, yeah, oh my God. If it’s preseason, you go to a preseason game, it’s like, all right, let’s have some fun, let’s have some hot dogs or whatever you want to have there. And you have to know this as the person who is there and you have to know, are they there because of you, are you the main act or are you just a bridge or what is your role in that? 

Well, and then, when I know that I can go to, okay, what’s my call to action in terms of preparation? If I speak somewhere, what is it that at the end of the event, what is the feeling that I want to leave them behind with? What is the feeling that I want them to leave the stadium, that I want them to leave the event? And I go from there, and then, I work backwards. How do I start into it? And then, how to build it up to get to where I want to go?

Taylorr: Wow, man, the succinct process style.

Austin: Hopefully, you’re writing this down.

Taylorr: What I love about what you just broke down is it was super meta, because you’re right, Ronny, before the show, you asked us all of these things. And so, you were treating even just this podcast as an event and we’re three guys hanging out, talking about the business, versus a 50,000-person stadium show that you’re about to do; it was the same process that you followed. So, the size of that audience doesn’t change your process at all, which was, really, cool walking through it.

Ronny: It does not, Taylorr, because here’s the point. You always want to know who your audience is.

Taylorr: Yeah.

Ronny: Because if you don’t know who it is and what the outcome is, if it’s a different audience or a different outcome, I’m going to talk about different things or, maybe, at a different angle.

Austin: Right. It’s something that’s so simple, that’s so easy to take for granted, and this is, especially, true for the people that are seasoned because you, really, do start to take it for granted, it’s routine, you’re just doing the same thing every single time. But that’s not the right angle because you’re leaving value on the table for the people that you could connect with better if you were to take a second to stop and slow down and figure out how you can make those little tweaks and changes to whatever you’re delivering so that people get more value out of it. 

And it sounds like this is true not even just for the size of the audience, but for the different mediums in which you’re getting in front of people, whether you’re hosting a gigantic stadium or whether you’re on a podcast like this, I imagine it’s the exact same if you’re getting on stage to deliver a keynote. So, if you’re getting in front of people, it sounds like the core thing that you’re saying is understand what they want so that you can give that to them. Is that fair?

Ronny: Yeah. Even if you’re writing a book, for example, I would still treat it the same way. Or if I’m going to deliver a seminar, it’s going to be different, it’s not going to be, maybe, an hour or something, it’s going to be, maybe, two days or something. But still, I need to know what’s my outcome, then I can break it down into days. But also, who is my audience? And then, for every day, what is the outcome of the day what is going to be the end goal of every day? And then I convert it backwards.

Taylorr: Yeah, that’s right. Simple. And that just helps with the preparation of all of it, you go in with that conviction, that internal work, you’re there, you show up, you’re 100%. When you know what you’re there to do and who you’re there to serve, it, maybe, is less difficult to get in front of those larger audiences.

Ronny: I just had a guy who I was helping, he was the CEO of a company, and he was creating his first keynote speech. And, basically, we had two and a half meetings, it was a first zoom call, and then, we had two live meetings, but it was like, okay, on a zoom call, it was just about, basically, structuring; to help him structure his ideas. Because, and again, asking those questions, what’s your outcome and who’s your audience. And just by those questions, he completely restructured what he; originally, had in mind to then, when we had the first real meeting, he completely had changed everything because he went down that path the right way. 

And then, when we met, it was okay, let’s go through the content, let’s see how we can even work on that to make it even more smooth, to make it even better for your target audience. And then, the last step, the next meeting was all about performance. How can we enhance your performance? How can we make it that you are more engaging? How can we make it that you are even better serving them and still being yourself? Because it’s not about putting on a mask when you’re up on a stage. 

It’s not about being somebody else or being a copy of somebody, but it’s about, of course, it’s awesome to take different things from different people that you admire, that are role models. And, at the same time, when you’re out there, you need to find who is it inside of you that you want to be? You need to create yourself.

Taylorr: Man.

Austin: That’s powerful right there.

Taylorr: For sure.

Austin: I felt that in my heart, Ronny.

Taylorr: For real, holy cow, man, I feel like we could be here for hours talking about this stuff. Ronny, what a cool episode. Thank you for sharing your perspective, your experience, the life you’ve lived. It’s really, really cool stuff. If someone wants to learn more, they want to connect with you, what’s the best way for them to do that?

Ronny: First of all, ronnyleber.com, I guess we’re going to have it in the show notes. And also, there’s an English version of my website and there’s a blog on it. So, basically, there are many topics that we talked about also on the blog or write me a message. At the same time, you can also, of course, hit me up on social media, on LinkedIn, on Instagram, on Facebook/ronny.leber and you will find me there.

Taylorr: Awesome, we’ll make sure all of those links are in the show notes. Ronny, thank you again for coming on the show today. And, guys, if you like this episode, don’t forget to rate it, like it, subscribe to it, and if you want more awesome resources like this, go to speakerflow.com/resources.

Austin: Bye, everybody.