S. 2 Ep. 48 – The Do’s And Don’ts Of Podcast Guesting

Picture of Cece Payne

Cece Payne

Marketing Coordinator at SpeakerFlow - Follow us on social media to stay in the flow!

Cece Payne

Marketing Coordinator at SpeakerFlow - Follow us on social media to stay in the flow!
Technically Speaking S 2 Ep 48 - The Dos And Donts Of Podcast Guesting with SpeakerFlow and Christie Bilbrey

Podcast guesting seems pretty straightforward, right? Get invited to come on someone’s show, talk for a bit of time, and leave. Simple.

Not so fast!

If you’re putting any amount of time into podcast guesting – coming on to other people’s shows and sharing your expertise – you want to make sure you’re doing it strategically.

How do you qualify shows to be on? Should you only look for podcasts with large audiences? How do you turn guesting into dollars?

We get asked about using podcasting as a marketing vehicle all the time and decided to bring in an expert to help us cover this.

Christie Bilbrey is a podcast PR agency owner and marketing strategist. With a background working in PR & marketing in the U.S. Senate, The White House, at McKinsey & Company, and Paul Hastings, she knows what’s possible when effective messaging is shared with the right audiences.

Her podcast PR agency grows her clients’ authority, credibility, and revenue by booking them as guest speakers on podcasts to connect with new audiences by sharing their stories and insights.

Least to say, Christie is the go-to when it comes to this topic.

Let’s dive in!

Watch the Podcast 👀

Listen to the Podcast 🎤

Show Notes 📓

✅ Check out Christie’s 10 Tips To Grow Your Business As A Podcast Guest: https://bit.ly/pod-guesting

✅ Listen to Christie’s show, The Business That Story Built Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-business-that-story-built/id1468020215

📷 Watch the video version of this episode and subscribe for updates on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLYAr3nGy6lbXrhbezMxoHTSCS40liusyU

🎤 Thank you to our sponsor, Libsyn Studio (formerly Auxbus)! Want the best podcasting solution out there? Learn more here: https://www.libsynstudio.com/

🚀 And as always, don’t forget about all the mind-blowing free resources at https://speakerflow.com/resources/

Read the Transcription 🤓

Taylorr: Oh, and we are live. Welcome to the show, Christie. It is amazing to have you here today. I can’t believe you decided to hang out with us for a half hour.

Christie: Thank you so much for having me. I was like, eh, it’s a Friday afternoon. They seem like chill guys. Why not? Why not?

Taylorr: Why not? Yeah, well.

Austin: That’s where I like to sit, right in the why not category, you know?

Taylorr: Oh, man, this is going to be a good show. Okay, so, Christie, you’re from Arizona, right?

Christie: I am. We’re in monsoon season right now.

Taylorr: Monsoon season. That is.

Austin: Good times.

Taylorr: Some of our favorite weather. Austin and I, I don’t know if you know this, we, actually, met in Arizona. We were both living down there for a while.

Christie: I did not, I know you lived there, I didn’t know you were both there. Oh, very cool. So, you’ve experienced monsoons?

Taylorr: Oh, for sure, they’re amazing.

Austin: Yeah.

Taylorr: Best storms on the planet.

Christie: Yes.

Austin: Funny side story. We moved to Arizona from Portland, my wife and I, right? Very, drastically, different climate, and so we’re driving down, preparing ourselves for the driest, hottest weather ever. We’re like, oh my gosh, here we go. And we get here, it’s, actually, right about this time of year and the next day just, absolute, downpour and.

Christie: Wow.

Austin: Of course, because the ground is so dry, I guess, the water doesn’t absorb very well. So, you know this, obviously, but people that don’t live in Arizona might not know, the water just flows off the ground, into the streets.

Christie: Oh, yeah.

Austin: And so, it is shocking how much water it appears that there is since it’s not being absorbed into the ground very much.

Christie: Yeah.

Austin: And there’s a lot of water in the beginning, but I felt like people lied to me. Yeah.

Christie: Yeah. We, actually, do get rain.

Taylorr: Yeah.

Christie: Believe it or not.

Taylorr: Awesome rain too.

Austin: True.

Taylorr: It’s, really, cool [Pepperidge – 1:41] Farms.

Austin: I’m in Utah. Utah’s, actually, drier than Arizona. Utah’s the second driest state in the country behind Nevada, but everybody thinks Arizona is super dry, I don’t even think it’s top three. I think New Mexico might be drier than Arizona too.

Taylorr: Really?

Austin: Yeah.

Taylorr: Wow, I didn’t even know that.

Austin: Weird, huh?

Christie: Well, that makes me feel a little bit better. Thank you.

Austin: Yeah, for sure. Yeah.

Taylorr: Also, one of our favorite sandwich places in the world is in Arizona. So, Christie, I don’t know if you like sandwiches or not, but Ike’s Love & Sandwiches, have you ever had that?

Christie: No.

Taylorr: Oh my goodness, are you serious? Okay.

Austin: Christie?

Taylorr: All right. I’ll send you a link.

Christie: Guys, Taylorr has all of the best links.

Taylorr: Yeah. No, you have to get Ike’s. And anybody listening who’s in Arizona, comment, let us know if you Ike’s. Best sandwich place on the planet. We dream about it. In fact, we were in, was it.

Austin: Vegas.

Taylorr: Vegas, Austin?

Austin: Yeah.

Taylorr: Yeah. I think it was for an NSA conference, it was, maybe, last summer. And we found, just in a gas station randomly, there was an Ike’s sandwich place there. We lost our mind. It was the best day of our lives.

Christie: So, what’s your favorite sandwich there?

Austin: Oh.

Taylorr: Oh God.

Austin: Christie, There are a 150 of them on the menu.

Taylorr: It’s crazy.

Austin: No joke.

Taylorr: Yeah.

Austin: Mine is Chester the Cheetah, though, which is an elevated grilled cheese, and it is unbelievable. I will say, though. And, Taylorr, you may agree with this or maybe not, but the, actual, internals of the sandwich, they’re interesting and fun, which is cool. But the bread is by far the best part. It’s this perfect combo of crunchy on the outside, soft on the, oh my gosh.

Taylorr: It’s that Dutch bread. Oh, yeah, it’s crazy. Yeah.

Austin: I’m done with the show, I’m flying to Arizona.

Christie: Break out.

Taylorr: For sure, we need a food podcast, Austin. Holy crap.

Christie: Yes.

Taylorr: To eat some food and hangout.

Austin: Will you join us on that one, Christie?

Christie: Of course, of course.

Taylorr: Sweet.

Austin: Good.

Taylorr: Well, unfortunately, guys, we’re not here to talk about sandwiches the entire time, I know that’s why you tune into the show, but we are, definitely, excited to unpack this episode. Podcasting, using it as a marketing vehicle, getting revenue from it, branding and storytelling and all of the things are listeners love, and, I would say, need. Christie, you have a ton of messaging experience, your background is incredible, I’m excited to unpack some of that, but I guess one of my starting questions is, how did you get into the world of podcasting from the messaging side of things? How did that transition happen?

Christie: Needing to grow a business.

Taylorr: Oh, okay.

Christie: That’s where it, really, came from. So, I started marketing strategy, after I left corporate and politics, I had done so much marketing strategy, that’s where I started. And I went very quickly from thinking, oh, I have all this great background, now I’m just going to pour into these small businesses, easy-peasy, right? This is going to be great. And then, realizing, oh my gosh, I never learned how to market myself. This is, totally, a different ballgame. And so, that led me into the brand story world, and this is seven years ago, at this point. 

So, learning everything I can about brand story, just so that I can feel like I can connect with my audience and I don’t have to be some sleazy salesperson or super pushy or whatever, just knowing that there is a space, for me, as a business owner and to be successful. So, I, really, did it for myself, and then, talked to other people, they wanted that, great. So, created an online course, created their stories for them, and then, they said, okay, great. I have this story; I can put this in my content. Where else can I use this? How can I use this? 

I guess one of the big things was seeing so many people who have great content that they pour out to their audience, that they have a small audience. And despite so many people saying, all you have to do is have great content and the people will come. I saw that wasn’t the case a lot of times. And so, I found that, really, it’s okay, you have poured a lot of work into this great content. Let’s get it in front of other people and without, necessarily, spending ads, so what’s an easy way to do that. Yeah, there are a ton of ways you can do that, but for, especially, a lot of the people I work with work from their home. 

So, podcasts were an incredible vehicle, obviously, coming from brand story. Podcasts are great because it’s long-form storytelling platform; it, really, lends itself to sharing stories with people to connect with new audiences, which is exactly what I was doing in brand story. So, that’s what, really, brought me there, and then, both on the end of creating my own podcast, The Business That Story Built, and then, at the same time, seeing, well, I also want to get in front of other audiences, and so I want to be on other podcasts. 

And then, I just recommended it to all of my clients before I even started doing it, I’m like, you just have to do this, you just have to add this to your marketing. And then, I, kind of, realized, why don’t I make it easier and help them do that. So, that is a little bit of the circuitous path that led me here.

Taylorr: Wow. That’s so awesome.

Austin: So, you started with marketing expertise, obviously.

Christie: Right.

Austin: And so, you go out to do your own thing and realize, I need to figure out how to apply these principles to myself, leads you to brand story; you realize podcasting is a great medium for that long-form storytelling component. And then because of your own successes with that, you decide to help your clients do it, which, eventually, becomes an offering for you. Is that.

Christie: Exactly.

Austin: The story I just heard?

Christie: Perfectly said, Austin.

Austin: I love that. What’s so great is that it’s rooted in context, like so many, and Taylorr and I both come from a marketing background as well. So, I think I can say this pretty confidently, but there are a lot of tactics that people just throw out there, and a lot of people will just try them because they’re the tropes, they’re the things that we should be doing, i.e. dumping a bunch of money into paid ads or something like that. But, really, I find that the best marketing tactics for each specific business are the ones that are contextualized into the foundation that they already have built. 

And so, because of that, you’re able to then make better results and the understanding of why it’s important starts to matter a lot more, so that seems like a shining example of you starting a, really, successful marketing venture for yourself based on the scenario that you were in, not just because some random person was telling you to do so. So, I applaud you for that and I also can see why it’s been successful.

Christie: Thank you. Thank you.

Taylorr: Sure.

Austin: Yeah.

Taylorr: So, one of the things that, I guess, I’m trying to internalize the questions of our clients, because we get a lot of these podcast-related questions, and one of them is, should I start my own show? Should I be a guest on shows? Do you have an answer to that question? Do you ever come across that in your clients? The kind of, differences between hosting your own show and guesting on a show and pros and cons of each?

Christie: Yeah. It’s interesting. I feel like, for one, a lot of people don’t have a ton of extra time. So, from a convenience, an ease standpoint purely, that’s a great reason to start guesting. Another is if you’re contemplating your own show, the best place to learn what you like and don’t is to go be on a bunch of shows and see what other people are doing. You’re like, I thought that was the approach, but I can see it’s not going to play out in reality the way it was in my head or, oh, I never would’ve thought of that. That’s such a cool idea. 

So, I think it’s a great place to get inspired; it’s a great place to hone your message and play around with different topics and, maybe, even tweak what you thought your niche was going to be for your podcast based on experiences that you have. I just feel like until you, really, throw yourself out there, I feel that’s the best way to do it, if you don’t already have a podcast start with guesting, I would recommend doing six months, but I’d say at least three months. The reason I say six is because this is something I feel isn’t communicated enough with people who are curious, who I talk to about guesting is, okay, so how long does it take until I get results? This may be a question that you guys would bring up as well. 

So, how long does it take until I get results? Well, this isn’t just a tactic of me saying I’m trying to make sales, but podcasting is, really, interesting, I know you guys definitely know this. But some podcasts will book you, I’ve had some where they’re like, Hey, somebody canceled, can your client come on tomorrow? That’s very unusual. Occasionally, that will happen. But a lot of times when you successfully pitch a podcast, they’ll say, wonderful, we want to have you as a guest. We can have you on in two months. And then, not only that, but then it’s like, okay. And then, when is it going to be released? In another two months. So, that means, okay, four months from the time that we got a yes. 

So, I think just knowing that it can take time, there will be some who are like, great, we’ll have you on next week and it’ll be out the following week. That’s awesome. But they are all over the map, so if you’re going into this as a strategy, just keep in mind, this is a long-term strategy. It is worth it and I’m sure we’ll get into why it’s worth it. But you have to remember, this is something that takes time. So, should you just guest for three months? Maybe not, because it’s going to take a while until you, really, see results and, actually, get to record a lot of those episodes. So, I say, give yourself half a year to, really, play with it. This shouldn’t be the only thing you’re doing with your marketing, but I think it is, really, impactful, really, effective; it just takes some time.

Taylorr: Oh, man, I love that answer. Yeah, super. It’s rooted in experience, you know the game, it just takes time to.

Christie: Yeah.

Taylorr: And at-bats, the cool thing about guesting is you get to refine that story and that brand message, and you see what resonates and what doesn’t and before even considering to have your own show, getting very clear on that direction, I think is, really, valuable.

Christie: Right.

Austin: Well, setting expectations is so important too. And we live in a world where people want instantaneous results.

Taylorr: Yeah.

Austin: And so, the patience required

Taylorr: Did we lose Austin’s audio?

Christie: I think so.

Taylorr: Yeah, Austin, your audio just left.

Austin: Hello.

Taylorr: There we go.

Christie: There you are.

Taylorr: Nice.

Austin: We back?

Taylorr: Back. Yeah.

Austin: Okay.

Taylorr: We cut it out like you know.

Austin: Do you remember where I was before that? Maybe, if I go one sentence back then cut it a little better.

Taylorr: Where was it?

Christie: You were just, kind of, starting when it cut.

Taylorr: Yeah, you were just starting the sentence, basically.

Austin: I’m just going to restart that whole phrase, deal?

Taylorr: Okay, great.

Austin: Okay. All right. So, yeah, my point is, expectations are so important when you’re going into something like this, because the reality is that, and I think for our listeners, brief technical glitch there, but where I was going with my sentence before my audio cut out was that podcasting is not that different from blogging. And that if we put out a blog today, first of all, it’s going to take a little while for Google to index it and even know that it’s there at all, let alone for Google to see it as an authoritative enough blog to start ranking it higher and higher up in Google. 

So, a blog you post today may not even actualize in Google’s algorithms for another 6 to 12 months, and so you’re writing content for the here and now for what is, sort of, hope, but strategic hope that Google gives us what we want out of that blog later on. And same deal for podcast, even if we record it today and it publishes tomorrow, it might take a little bit of time for the audience to go listen to it and to internalize it to a point where they may want to take action to reach out. And so, this is, at least from my perspective, a longer-haul move than say, picking up the phone and making cold calls. 

And so, I think why I’m pointing this out is that the expectations going into that will give somebody the patience to do it for long enough and consistently enough to, actually, then see the benefits on the tail-end. Maybe you agree with that.

Christie: Yeah, absolutely. And I think people should, that’s just great, another way of saying don’t think there’s anything wrong with you or that you’re doing it wrong because you’re not getting these instant results, it’s just not the way it, typically, happens. I have had, kind of, a freak occurrence, where I was on a show and it published pretty quickly, and a couple of weeks later I got the cold email saying, Hey, I just heard you on this guy’s show, can we set up a call? I don’t like to say that’s the norm. 

Yes, it can happen. It’s not the norm, but I don’t want to be totally doom and gloom that it’s like, don’t expect anything for 12 months, you will get more opportunities. You’ll have people start to find you to speak on other shows who say, Hey, I heard you here, I’d love to have you on this or maybe speaking in-person. It opens up a lot of doors in the meantime while momentum is building. So, I think that gives people a little bit of hope in the journey as it happens, and I, probably, didn’t answer the other half of Taylorr’s question, which was, how does this compare with having your own podcast? 

And I think the interesting thing, because you guys know, it takes years to build an audience as a podcaster, and there’s a lot of work that goes into it. However, a lot of podcasters, as you know, like to be on other podcasts as well. So, it’s a very symbiotic relationship, it’s not that I would, necessarily, say pick one, which path do you go down. A lot of times its which one are you going to start with? I would say, start with guesting. If you love it, then, yeah, maybe, it is something that you consider having your own show, but even if you have your own show, you’re going to want to be on other shows as well as a guest and, a lot of times, you’ll see, just as we’re doing here. 

I had Taylorr on my show, I’m on his show; you see a lot of overlap. And like, Ooh, I love that topic; you need to come on here. It’s a great community, so once you get in and you start, you’re going to start getting a lot of ideas, whether that’s ideas of other topics you want to do on other shows or ideas you might have for your own show. So, they’re not exclusive to one another, they play very well together

Taylorr: For sure. No, I like it. It’s, kind of, like a roadmap, just start with guesting and if you feel like you want to go down the full-blown have your own show route, go do it and you’ll get all those at-bats in the meantime. One thing that’s popped up, for me, as we’ve been talking is, how do you successfully vet a show to be on? Do you appear anywhere that someone’s willing to have you and just get your swings in or do you need to be strategic in the shows that you’re picking? And if so, how? What are your thoughts there?

Christie: Yeah, I think to a degree, I think you don’t want to be overly. So, I’ll, kind of, share, I guess, the good and the bad. I feel like you need to have some strategy going in. Yes, there’s a lot of experimentation that happens where you’re refining your message and playing around with things, but you should have a pretty good idea. What’s my goal with this? I think that’s a good place to start. A lot of people, it’s credibility, it’s lead generation, it’s thought leadership; it’s, kind of, a combination of things, because the more shows you’re on, you’re going to get all these links on Google. 

And so, people who Google you, which this is another reason to do it, if somebody finds out about you from a friend or they see you somewhere, they’re going to Google you, probably. And then, if you have all these links popping up, then it’s like, oh wow, this person’s in demand. Well, what are you in demand for? Because you want to make sure that you are approaching this from the standpoint of, what do you want to build? What do you want to be known for? And so, there are some different ways you can approach this. Yes, obviously, it’s okay. Take me, for example, PR, marketing, podcasting, brand story; those are a few different topics that I can easily speak to. 

But then, it’s also knowing who is your ideal buyer. And so, a lot of the clients who come to me, a lot of people in my audience are women over 40. Okay. So, that opens it up a little bit more. You have to, really, think about the perspective of your audience, who you’re trying to get in touch with, because are they going to podcast to learn? Probably, somewhat. Are they going to just relax and unwind and have fun?

Well, what other podcasts might they be listening to where if you, totally, put all of your eggs in one basket with, I am only doing marketing shows? Okay. Well, how much of your audience are you missing by thinking about like, okay, I’m also a Christian woman business owner, there are some that are just that or some that are just with interest that you think, is this something that comes up a lot for my buyer persona. So, some of that is, kind of, going into demographics of who is your audience? What do they like? What are different topics? I have a client who she was previously a lawyer, she’s an executive coach now. Okay, great. 

So, we put her on legal shows. We put her on shows about mindset and leadership and that, well, she’s also done a lot of great things with investing that, kind of, play a part in what she does with her clients. So, we’ve also been pitching her to personal finance shows, which you might not, necessarily, think about from executive coaching, but for her, for her background, it just happens to work, and we know that a lot of the people who listen to those can fit into her category of women executives. 

So, I think it’s, really, just taking a good look at what do you have to offer holistically that can tie into your core message and that’s where you should go. But should you just go to anyone? No, I think, even though, you might think, well, you’re just clicking the button to login and spend 30 minutes. Well, okay, but that’s still 30 minutes of your time, you still have to promote it, you still prepare for it. So, no, I don’t think you should just go to anywhere, and then, when you know, okay, these are my core topics, now I want to research shows within that area, which shows within that area should I consider?

So, I’ll tell you, what I look at is, for one thing, is it still a current show? That matters because if you guys know, there are so many podcasts out there that may have been done for a year or two. And so, they’re still showing up in results for like, what’s the top show for whatever, because that’s the beauty of podcasting SEO, it does last for years. But you don’t want to waste time pitching shows that, Hey, they’re not even current. Do they have guests? There are a lot of shows that might seem, oh, this is perfect, I want to pitch them. Well, they don’t accept guests; they’re just a solo show, that’s all they do. Okay. 

So, those aren’t good. Do they have a little bit of sticking power? So, do they only have four episodes? Because we don’t, really, know if they’re going to be around tomorrow. So, make sure they have some, ideally, they have some reviews, not that they have to have millions, but does anybody have any, kind of, feedback on them? Are they promoting this in any way? So, those are a few things. And then, just taking a look at their topics. So, just, kind of, skimming through, what are the episode titles? Are any of those, kind of, does it seem like the host is looking for topics that you can speak to? 

Because as a podcaster, which is, really, the perspective that I take with my guest when it comes to pitching is, what irritates me about people who pitch me that I’m like, I’m not even responding to this one because. And when you think about what makes a good pitch, it’s personalized, right? So, there are so many people who might just see, oh, she has a marketing show, my client he does marketing too, so I’m just going to throw him in there. Well, okay, but The Business That Story Built, what’s the tie to my show? Did you look at any of my episodes? Did you listen to anything? 

See, a tiny other thing is you have to realize that podcasters get pitched a lot, especially, if they have more than four episodes, if they have some staying power, they’re getting pitched a lot. So, how do you make yours stand out? You need to remove any guesswork, you need to say, yes, here’s our background, here is where they’d be perfect for your show; here’s the tie-in from what they do to what you do, so that podcaster can just quickly and easily say, oh, yeah, that’s a no brainer we want them. So, I think just taking any extra work away from the podcaster, if you think your show’s a perfect fit, then you need to spell that out and say exactly why.

Taylorr: For sure. We can speak to this personally; it is so annoying getting pitched. You’re like; did you even listen to the show? Geez. So, yes.

Austin: Yeah. Yeah. We’ve even had emails come in where they’re not even addressed to a person, but to just Technically Speaking as if it’s its own entity and we’re like, okay, we’re humans back here, so remember that, please. There’s so much valuable stuff there, so thank you for unpacking that, it, kind of, touched on both the hosting versus guesting and what shows to be on and also started getting into what you can do to, sort of, make your podcast guesting as effective as possible from the perspective of getting on shows, and I want to go a little deeper into that. 

I want to double a little bit back just to, kind of, close the loop on which shows to be a part of too, because I think the second most common question that we get behind, should I be on anything or something specific is how much does audience size matter? I have some assumptions about this. So, for instance, if you have a smaller audience, that audience may be a lot more engaged and a lot more willing to take whatever’s being said on the show seriously, since they, obviously, care enough to be one of the few followers, but also you don’t get as much exposure, so the law of averages may not work to your benefit quite as much. So, what’s your perspective on the size of the listenership for a specific podcast before you go guest on it?

Christie: I think it doesn’t matter as much as some people may think; I think there’s value to small, to medium and to large. So, I think a lot of people will say, if you were asked to speak at a retreat where there are not 500 people in the room, there might be 30 people in the room, but, as you said, they’re very engaged, they, really, care about this topic, they might be more qualified leads for what you do. So, you wouldn’t want to turn that down just as you also wouldn’t want to turn down speaking to 500 or a thousand or 10,000 people, they can both make sense, whereas, as you said, if you’re speaking to 10,000 people, there are, probably, going to be fewer people who, really, care because they might be there for just, it’s a big name, it’s a big name podcaster. 

So, they are not, necessarily, as focused on super niche, unless that person, that podcaster, that is just what they do. So, I think there’s value in all of it, so I don’t recommend, I think as long as it’s a solid podcast, they put out good content and your audience is there and they care about the topics that you speak about, I think it’s worthwhile. So, yeah, I pitch my clients across the board, there are some that are small, some that are medium, some that are large; I think more than anything, it’s where are you a good fit? Which shows do you connect with regardless of size? 

And you don’t know what they’re going to be like down the road and these links do last for years, and so it can be helpful for you. Part of it is a numbers game, you are trying, probably, to improve your credibility and authority, you want to be seen as like, wow, this person is everywhere on this topic, everybody wants them on their show or speaking in front of their audience. But, yeah, of course, you want to pitch big opportunities and you want to pitch small, so I don’t discriminate as much that way if it’s a, really, solid show that I think could be a good fit for my client.

Taylorr: Yeah. Amen. I, totally, agree with that. Yeah, thanks for breaking that down. Okay, so here’s another one for you. So, you mentioned this earlier, you want to have an outcome in mind of your podcast, guesting, or even running your own show, but let’s stick to, kind of, the guesting realm here. I think what a lot of people are looking for, especially from maybe a PR perspective, and you can tell me if I’m wrong here, by the way, but things like lead generation, turning it into revenue, I think those are some of the outcomes that people are thinking of right away, like, what’s my ROI and my time doing all of this, basically? 

Now, we’ve touched on this a little bit, it can take time, right? This is the long-haul play, six months, a year; you have to be consistent with it more than anything. But let’s say somebody’s on a show, what’s the best way to move their audience that you’re in front of, into your own and turn that into revenue? Should people have call to actions at the end of every show or is it just a matter of showing up and letting people know you exist, how passive or active should the process be of getting a show’s guest to become your own audience?

Christie: Well, I think the essence of PR, in general, is, really, having an opportunity to take control of your messaging. It’s just like, I had some clients who were previously on the news, they were newscasters for a long time and they spoke on my podcast about how to be a better interviewee, right? So, how can you be a better podcast guest speaker? And this is something we talked about, it was like, well, what if the person who’s show you’re on, you think a question is, totally, obvious and you’re expecting it and they never get to it, and you’re like, shoot, that’s what was going to, kind of, drive people to me and they’re not going there. 

And you just have to remember when you’re a guest, yes, you’re not the one who’s, necessarily, asking the questions, but you need to go into interviews knowing what is it that’s important to you to communicate and finding a way to work that into conversations. So, podcasters are all over the map, a lot of them are, really, great about saying, what are your links? We want to promote you, where do you want to send people? And others want to, they’re like, I don’t want to be pushy with my audience, I just want to keep it very conversational. 

So, you have to think about, okay, I don’t, totally, know if they are going to let me say, I have 10 tips to grow your business as a podcast guest, go there. Or if they’re just going to say, look her up online, or here’s her Instagram handle, but you in your answers can say, this is what I do for clients, this is my experience, and you can find a way to say, okay, here’s what this audience seems like they would be a gold mine for, in terms of my business. So, how can I make sure that my answers incorporate those pieces that are going to make people curious, show them that I have something that could be helpful for them, even if the only opportunity I have is for them to Google my name after the show? 

So, I think it’s just, kind of, being prepared for the worst, but also knowing, hey, a lot of shows are going to let you have a freebie or have something that you can promote to drive people. And so, I think it’s important to be prepared for both, best case scenario, yeah, have something that you know this is specifically, I wouldn’t say go in super broad, like, oh, I do all, kinds of, things for all, kinds of, people. Have a goal, have a CTA in mind with, this is, really, what I want to drive people to, so I’m going to make sure that my messaging and my answers are, really, focused on that.

Taylorr: Yeah.

Austin: Man. Hindsight being what it is, but I’m thinking like, of course, you just have to be prepared for both situations.

Taylorr: Based on the show. Yeah, for sure.

Austin: Because sometimes they’re going to tee it up and make it real easy for you and sometimes you might have to get a little creative to let people know that you’re open for business, which fair enough, that’s, kind of, the nature of being in business. So, to build on that just a little bit, let’s imagine a scenario where the podcast host is willing for you to make a small pitch at the end, go download my freebie or whatever it may be. Do you make recommendations for your clients as to what type of call to action tends to be the stickiest, in terms of, actually, getting leads from it? Or do you find that there’s not a perfect answer?

Christie: Well, I think everybody’s different in what they have. I think having a freebie is great. If you have a path that is specific to what you’re offering that can be great. And I think the easier you make it, if it’s sign up for my free master class, that’s still fine, but, obviously, people know, oh, that’s going to be an hour of my time, whatever. Even an e-book, it’s, kind of, like, I would say the easiest way is if you have a one-pager or you have something short that, maybe, later you can interest them in bigger things. 

But I think something where it’s like, oh, that’s just a quick, easy thing for me, the easier, the better, instead of, it doesn’t have to be what you’ve put your blood, sweat and tears into building some enormous thing. A lot of people don’t have time for that, they’re just like, oh, I, really, like what she said, what’s something quick that I can just keep at the ready. And I feel like people are more likely to go for that if they don’t know anything about you before investing more, and I’m just talking about time, I’m not even talking about money.

Taylorr: Wow.

Austin: Wow, man.

Taylorr: I love that answer for so many reasons. Austin and I talk about micro conversions all of the time. Just about getting one small, yes, at a time; you’re not marrying anybody yet, just small steps, baby steps, you know? So, that was the perfect answer, Christie. This has been a lot of fun and, really, valuable, you can tell you’re an expert at, exactly, what you do, so thanks for coming on and sharing your wisdom. Speaking of making it easy to pitch stuff at the end, what are you working on right now that our listeners can benefit from?

Christie: Well, definitely, I recommend they check out The Business That Story Built podcast.

Taylorr: Yes.

Christie: And if you do have any interest or curiosity in podcast guest speaking, then I do have 10 tips to grow your business with podcast guest speaking that I know Taylorr was kind enough to say they are going to include in the show notes.

Taylorr: We’ll think about it. I’m just kidding. No, for sure.

Austin: They’ll be there.

Taylorr: They’re in the show notes, guys, they are there. Austin will make me put them there.

Austin: Taylorr, snarky.

Taylorr: I know, I know, it’s Friday, you know what I mean? All right. Well, guys, if you like this episode, don’t forget to rate it, like it, subscribe to it, and if you want more awesome resources like this, go to speakerflow.com/resources.

Austin: Bye, everyone.

Taylorr: See you.

Austin: Yay.

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