S. 2 Ep. 32 – Ghostwriting Isn’t So Spooky After All

Cece Payne

Cece Payne

Content & Graphic Design Manager - Follow us on social media to stay in the flow!
Cece Payne

Cece Payne

Content & Graphic Design Manager - Follow us on social media to stay in the flow!
Technically Speaking S 2 Ep 32 - Ghostwriting Isnt So Spooky After All with SpeakerFlow and Cindy Tschosik

In today’s episode, we’re talking with mental health speaker and ghostwriter Cindy Tschosik.

When Cindy isn’t on stage, she ghostwrites nonfiction books for psychology professionals, mental health influencers, and performing artists to share their expertise on mental health topics and their journey to mental wellness.

As a certified ghostwriter, Cindy knows first-hand what it takes to write a book that’s engaging, successful, and communicates the value one hopes to provide.

And in this week’s episode, we’re talking with her about what it’s like from the author’s perspective to hire a ghostwriter, why it can be more beneficial than writing a book yourself, and removing some of the fear people may have when considering hiring a ghostwriter.

As always, stick around until the end for some awesome resources Cindy has, and we hope you like this one.

See you there!

Watch the Podcast 👀

Listen to the Podcast 🎤

Show Notes 📓

✅   Download Cindy’s “Perfect Book Checklist”: https://www.soconnectedllc.com/download-the-perfect-book-checklist

📷   Watch the video version of this episode and subscribe for updates on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLYAr3nGy6lbXrhbezMxoHTSCS40liusyU

🎤   Thank you to our sponsor, Libsyn Studio (formerly Auxbus)! Want the best podcasting solution out there? Learn more here: https://www.libsynstudio.com/

🚀   And as always, don’t forget about all the mind-blowing free resources at https://speakerflow.com/resources/

Read the Transcription 🤓

Taylorr: Welcome to another episode of Technically Speaking, we’re your hosts, Taylorr and Austin; and in today’s episode, we’re talking with mental health speaker and ghostwriter, Cindy Tschosik. And when Cindy isn’t on stage, she ghostwrites non-fiction books for psychology professionals, mental health influencers, and performing artists to share their expertise on mental health topics and their journey to mental wellness. As a certified ghostwriter, Cindy knows firsthand what it takes to write a book that’s engaging, successful and communicates the value that one hopes to provide when writing a book. 

And in this week’s episode, we’re talking with her about what it’s like from the author’s perspective to hire a ghostwriter, why it can be more beneficial than writing a book yourself, and honestly, to remove some of the fear people may have when considering hiring a ghostwriter. So, as always stick around until the end for some awesome resources Cindy has, and we hope you like this one.

Austin: Boom. Alright, I think we’re live, right? We live?

Taylorr: I think we’re live. I don’t know, we’re going to do it anyway.

Austin: How funny would it be if we just recorded this whole podcast and then none of it actually was recorded?

Taylorr: Well.

Cindy: Thank God for evidence.

Taylorr: As it goes.

Austin: We’re going to have a fun conversation no matter what.

Taylorr: Who cares about recording the podcast, we’re just here with Cindy.

Austin: Yeah, that’s right. We’ve been looking forward to this one. So, thank you for joining us today.

Cindy: My pleasure.

Austin: Not only are we really excited about this topic, as is our audience, we’re really excited about you. You’re just a great human being. So, thank you for joining us.

Cindy: Thank you. Oh my gosh.

Austin: Yeah, totally.

Cindy: It’s all smoke and mirrors.

Taylorr: That’s everybody, so we’re just going to pretend.

Cindy: That’s why I’m a ghostwriter.

Taylorr: That’s right.

Austin: So, we’re definitely going to dive into this. We always do a little bit of digging about our guests prior to the show and we’ve been working together for a couple of years now, so we know you pretty well, but we always learn something new when we do this research. We’re on your site and we saw, obviously, you live in Chicago, so holla; I’d be interested to hear your favorite deep-dish place. But you mentioned that in Chicago, well, you live there, but you also like hiking and traveling, and writing on the beach was one of the things that you mentioned. And I just am trying to figure out how the writing on the beach thing works in Chicago, because I don’t think there are a lot of beaches in Chicago.

Cindy: Yes. Well, there are beaches in Chicago at the lake, but I don’t frequent them often with my laptop. Writing on the beach is more reserved for places like Turks and Caicos and Mexico, those types of things where they have the pool with the beach, with the ocean.

Taylorr: Yeah, that’s right, that’s how it is too.

Austin: A lot more spent.

Cindy: And I’m in any one of those sections and as long as they’re serving me my lunch and my beverages.

Taylorr: Emphasis on beverages, please.

Cindy: It’s actually been my retirement dream for a long time to just ghostwrite books on a beach.

Taylorr: Heck. Yeah.

Cindy: And when I streamline from having the marketing agency for five years to ghostwriting full-time, I’m like, okay, I’ll do this now and I’ll get the beach later. So, the beach is coming, and it comes every time I’m on vacation, I do spend a little time writing just because it’s luxurious.

Austin: Yeah.

Taylorr: Yeah. It’s all about the vision.

Austin: It’s true.

Cindy: It’s all about the vision, so I have to live it, right?

Austin: That’s right.

Taylorr: Sounds good.

Austin: Something about that environment too.

Cindy: But it’ll come sooner or later for sure.

Austin: For sure. Okay. So, what’s your favorite beach to write on? Is there a top-of-the-class sort of situation?

Cindy: Grand Turks is the best, that is where I wrote my first blog and officially my first blog as a ghostwriter full-time, and, yeah, that’s my favorite place on earth. Some of my ashes are going to be spread there, but don’t tell anybody.

Taylorr: We’ll do our best.

Austin: Well, you did just publicly state this on the internet. Oh, that’s awesome though. I’m actually going to Grand Turk for my first time this year, so you’re going to have to, yeah, maybe we can have a sidebar at some point, you can tell me the fun things you go do.

Cindy: Oh, yes, we do. That’s, oh, my favorite place on earth. It’s gorgeous.

Austin: Very excited.

Cindy: You’re going to love it. It’s gorgeous. Gorgeous.

Austin: That’s awesome.

Cindy: Yeah.

Austin: Oh, man. Okay. Well, now, people, if you’re going to the Caribbean, then Cindy’s the person to talk to.

Taylorr: That’s right.

Austin: Well, yeah. So, we want to dive in, obviously, as the title of this episode suggests, and as you already sort of hinted at, we’re going to talk a lot about ghostwriting today. But before we fully segue into that topic, I just want to point out that you’re kind of a fascinating character to me since you have sort of two pillars to the business, you do the ghostwriting but you’re also a professional speaker and you speak on mental health and wellness and so.

Cindy: Right.

Austin: How did those two things separately come to be, and I’m also sort of curious which one came first?

Cindy: It’s like the chicken and the egg. No, it takes a village. And so, the ghostwriting evolved from my marketing agency back in 2018. So, when I opened So Connected, it was a marketing agency, full-service, I served speakers, therapists, coaches, and business owners. And when I streamlined to ghostwriting five years later, again, the same people that I was working with and the mental health piece came about because when I was in a particular situation, it was a dark day, I was actually planning my suicide.

Taylorr: Oh.

Cindy: When I came out of that and when I came out of that space, I knew as soon as I stood up that I was supposed to be there so I could share my story and serve other people and help other people see different perspectives and such. And then, so I knew at some point I would be speaking about it, then when I was working with my first mentor for speaking, she was actually my first client from my marketing agency, Colonel Jill Morgenthaler, who became a friend and everything. 

She had told me, she’s like, oh, you’re going to be speaking one day. And I said, oh, no, I’m happy behind my laptop, just writing away. And she’s like, no; you’ll be a speaker within two years. And two years came, and I was at lunch with her and I told her, I said, I’m going to share my mental health story, I’m going to start speaking, and this was 2000, probably 18, 2018. She was so excited. And she said, oh my gosh. She’s like, I’m going to be your coach, I’m not charging you anything, I want to make you the best speaker you could ever be. And I was flattered because she was who I wanted to be on stage. Unfortunately, three weeks later she was in the Caribbean and died after a scuba diving session.

Taylorr: Oh.

Austin: Awe.

Cindy: And she was a very, very experienced scuba diver. So, phew, it took the wind out of our sails for sure at NSA Illinois, and anyone who knew her was just devastated by it, because she was a force. She was awesome. So, she was kind of the one I was hanging out with, and when you rub elbows with the people that you like and you enjoy being around, they kind of rub off on you and you become a speaker. But the ghostwriting definitely came first and then the speaking and now it kind of, and then another part of the village was that a couple of years ago, right after COVID, or right when COVID started, I started wondering what my brand should be. 

Should I have two websites, one for speaking, one for writing services, and Peggy Nashavaria from NSA, and her own company, was my coach. And she said, well, Cindy, why wouldn’t you? Because the speaking was all on business books mostly. I’m sorry, the ghostwriting was on business books, the speaking was on stage for mental health. And she said, well, why don’t you just write books for people that are professionals in mental health and wellness and influencers and those types of people. And I said, oh my gosh. So, she helped me mold it, because some great ideas we can’t come up with on our own. 

So, then I blended it and that’s what I did, was I speak on mental health. I also speak on how to write books, obviously, that’s why I’m here today and then I have my writing services and author coaching services.

Austin: Yeah. Wow, man, that’s so cool.

Cindy: Yeah, that’s how it came to be.

Taylorr: What a journey.

Austin: Awesome that you attribute this to those people that have influenced you too. It does take a village.

Cindy: Oh, for sure.

Austin: I think that’s well said.

Taylorr: It sure does.

Cindy: There are so many people that have helped me through the years, it’ll be nine years this year and I wouldn’t be here standing in the business still, if I didn’t have the right supporters and coaches and models and encouragement from all the professionals around me and supportive people like you guys at Speaker Flow, who help with the tactical and logistical stuff. It does, it takes a village to be successful and keep your business going and expanding and growing. So, I’m grateful, eternally grateful for everybody who’s touched my life.

Taylorr: Yeah, man, for sure.

Austin: Isn’t that the truth? I think all of us. Hey, take a second, if you’re listening to this, and just feel that appreciation for the people that have helped you get where you are, because, man, I think it’s really easy to go through life without stopping to be grateful. So, thank you for being a model in gratitude for us here.

Cindy: Ah, for sure.

Austin: For sure. Yeah.

Taylorr: So, for the ghostwriting, it sounded like you kind of started in the marketing space for ghostwriting, right?

Cindy: I did.

Taylorr: So, how did that transition into books? Is that pretty natural that, that happened or where was the bridge there?

Cindy: Yeah, I’ve always wanted to be a writer and I always thought books would be kind of cool to write and my English teacher told me I’d be a writer. So, when I had the marketing agency, I was copy-editing and copywriting content for websites, I was doing marketing materials and brochures, media kits, one-sheets, all that stuff. And then I was also ghostwriting and editing articles. 

Well, that’s where my greatest strengths are, is the writing piece, every job I’ve ever been to I’ve been the assigned writer, so it just kind of evolved from there and then when I was still in my marketing agency in 2016, I mentioned to my esthetician that I was a ghostwriter and she said, oh my gosh, my whole dream in my whole life has been to write a book and I’m like, let’s go. So, we did, and then she referred me to somebody, and so that was two years, I had two new book clients, and so that was 16 and 17 and 18, I’m like, let’s just do this full-time because I’m loving it. It just was everything I ever wanted to be able to do just not with a beach yet. 

So, then I served to five years of the marketing agency, I streamline, because I was getting to the point where if I was going to continue with web development, there was so much new stuff I needed to know. And I was kind of like, oh, man, it was the whole story brand movement and I’m like, I really don’t want to learn story brand, because I was really involved, I like the writing, writing and it’s ironic because now I just hired a writer last week who’s, I just told you guys, a certified in story brand, and she’s writing my copy for my new website that’s coming in June.

Austin: That came full circle, huh?

Taylorr: Yeah. It’s funny how that works.

Cindy: Full circle. Yeah, exactly.

Austin: Oh, man. Wow. That’s so cool. So, it sounds like it kind of started just with your natural gift and then the right opportunities presented themselves and you said, yes, as great entrepreneurs do and that’s translated into the very successful business that you have today.

Cindy: Thank you.

Austin: Did I get that right, what a cool journey?

Cindy: It’s about following the breadcrumbs, God leaves us breadcrumbs along the way, and we need to follow them because if we don’t, the plans aren’t as grand as we hoped they’d be.

Austin: Oh, yeah. A mentor of Taylorr and I used to say that luck is created when preparation meets opportunity. It seems you’re a case study in that principle.

Cindy: Awe, thank you.

Austin: Well, not to say. Luck. I hate that word a little bit because it seems almost cheap, because it’s not.

Cindy: What’s that? Preparation?

Austin: The preparation, that part is hard. But the luck part, I don’t know if that’s actually the right word, but you seized the day, you seized the opportunity.

Cindy: Absolutely.

Taylorr: That’s right. Respect.

Cindy: Absolutely. For sure.

Taylorr: That’s awesome.

Austin: So, I feel I sort of understand this, but maybe not as much as I could, can you really help us understand, what is ghostwriting? What is that as it relates to somebody who’s writing a book?

Cindy: It’s a little tricky for some people. They don’t quite grasp it, but basically what it is, it’s when an author wants to write a book and that particular author may not have the time because they’re busy running their business, which is where they really should be. They don’t feel confident in their writing skills, or they just hate writing like I hate math, so they hire us to basically lend our skills of writing so that they could get their book done. And it happens through, I always start off with a discovery process to really deeply get acquainted with the author and the book and what they want for the book and then also how, because I have a speaking background, I’ve been with NSA for, gosh, I think five years now, too. 

If they’re a speaker or they’re doing something with it from a business standpoint, we map out in the strategy session, what those goals are and what they want to do, and how they’re going to use the book. And so, that’s really, really super important is kind of to start with the end in mind. So, once we get through the discovery and strategy process, then it’s a series of, by the time we have the strategy, we have the goals set for the reader, the author, and the business. And then we map out the, I call it the table of topics because I don’t consider it a table of contents until we kind of have a firm grip on what is the content about? 

Because we have to remain flexible in it, because chapter one may become chapter seven and vice versa. And so, once we have our table of topics to write on, then I interview them based on what that topic is, and then we go through a series of edits and then we move on to the next chapter and so on and so on.

Taylorr: Wow. That’s a pretty methodical process. That’s awesome. Very straightforward. Do you find, I imagine this, as you were kind of telling the story, I was thinking just about myself included in this, but I can imagine it can be pretty unclear, an author has a goal to write a book, you have that inspiration they want to write. I would imagine for some pretty unclear of what that book actually looks like, so I can imagine a lot of your job must be kind of chasing the squirrel, if you will, trying to pull in all of these ideas to have a common thread, what’s that process like for you?

Cindy: Well, it’s part of the discovery and sometimes I do visualizations and say, okay, when you want to write a book, you might have a concept. They may not even have a concept, but they know they need to write a book to better their business and expand their opportunities in their profession. And so, through a series of interviews and questions and getting to know them, I can come up with some suggestions on what we can work with and then also visualization. They know they want a book, if anybody wants a book, they have some kind of visual in their mind of what it looks like, is it medium size? 

Is it a small size? Is it hardcover, softcover? What is it that’s going to be important to them for it to look like? And so, we start there, that’s one of the things I ask right off the bat because I want to know also where I could kind of steer them to what kind of publishing or who to publish with or print or whatever, because if we’re doing hardcover, that might be a publisher that does hardcover. Some publishers don’t do hardcover, they just get it up on Amazon, you order it from Amazon and download your books in paperback, and so there are just a lot of things I get to know that is beyond just getting the manuscript done. 

Because one of the big things that’s important to me is that every author, whether they work with me or not is well informed about the entire process from concept to when they’re getting cash. And that’s important because there are lots of ghostwriters, there are lots of editors, there are lots of author coaches and book coaches and publishers and the whole gamut and I just want, the one thing that I encourage anybody I meet is just to do the research, vet the people, find the fit that’s best for you. 

Because it’s a long process and it’s an important part of your life and your business, or however you use the book, and you want to enjoy it and you don’t want extra stress and stuff. So, make sure you do your homework because what it comes down to is you could pick anybody, but are those people the right people for you.

Austin: Man, that’s good advice. That’s good advice, no matter what you’re doing, so just generally speaking. It sounds like it’s very consultative in a lot of ways too, so you probably want to like the person that you’re working with if you’re going to engage with them like that, you have to trust them and want to be hearing their feedback, right?

Cindy: Exactly. Yeah. You definitely don’t want to hire somebody whose voice irritates you or they’re clicking or chewing their gum or whatever. For sure, that’s one area to look at, but not that you can’t hire that person if you’re up for it, but it is, it’s very consultative, that’s the part I love the most is just that working together, that partnership, just because you’re not writing the book doesn’t mean this isn’t in your voice. A skilled ghostwriter will be able to write in your voice and also focus on the message, that the message that you want is getting through along with bringing in, one of my favorite parts is bringing in extreme value for the reader. 

Because we forget, we’re wrapped up in our story and stuff, and translating our story into something that’s valuable for the reader looks different sometimes from authors. And so, a ghostwriter is going to be able to kind of mold it and shape it so that it serves both purposes, that the author is getting to say what they want to say, but the reader’s getting something out of it as well. And there are all kinds of ways to structure a chapter to give really, really great and important value to the readers and that’s a fun part too.

Taylorr: Yeah.

Austin: Man, I never even thought about that.

Taylorr: No, I can see why just right out of the gates hiring a ghostwriter could be valuable, because you’re removing yourself from your bottle basically. You have somebody to work with you, to have a different perspective, to be considering all of these things, that when you’re writing a book yourself, you’re so close to it. It can be difficult to see some of those things and you might end up writing a book that might not be as valuable as if you had maybe partnered up with somebody to help maybe coax that along a little bit more.

Cindy: There are a lot of advantages to working with a ghostwriter. One of them is the structure of the book, the content of the book, the clarity of the book, the value for the readers. One of the other things is I write a lot of books that are emotionally compelling and emotional journeys that the author’s been on. Because right now, what I focus on is to work with people who want to write a book to change, save, and celebrate lives. And that’s with books that they want to write that are going to help heal people, so help people heal through their journey and everything. 

And so, the emotion part is really tough and what I love about what I do is that you can see the growth of the author as they’re releasing and sharing their story, they’re able to, I’ve had authors say, oh my gosh, I’m so different than I was six months ago when we started working together, I’m a new person, I’m sick of writing this part of my story. I don’t want to be the victim anymore. I’ve been able to forgive my wife and my family and move on and forgive myself and another woman, she was able to forgive the anger from all the people that came about after she closed her business for 30 years. 

So, it’s just so fascinating to see that growth and that’s what’s beautiful because while they’re writing a book to help others heal, they’re healing themselves. So, the ghostwriter taking a lot of that on and kind of, and I always wanted to be a therapist, I’ve always wanted to be a therapist. 

So, I’m kind of, well, I am an empath and very highly, emotionally intelligent, so a little intuitive there, and so I’m able to really kind of help them through that in a loving and supportive way. The funny thing is that I was at a book retreat with Cathy Fyock, from NSA, and for one day, and I thought, oh, God, I’m going to go because I have this book that I have to finish from an author that passed away, one of my clients and she passed away three years ago and I’m getting it started this fall. 

And we’re actually co-authoring it since I’m doing it after her, I promised her I’d finish it as a co-author and it’s about narcissism and she’s doing it from the adult side, the spouse side, I’m doing it from the child side. So, I go to Cathy’s workshop and I’m sitting there, I’m like I’m going to get my table of contents done, I’m going to start my chapters on me and figure out how it all blends with Anna’s book. And I sat there, and I started to write and I’m like, but I had an emotional, almost breakdown, I had to stop myself. I’m like, holy cow, I’m going to have to hire my own ghostwriter to write this book for me because I was just so emotional and the breakdown, it was just like, oh my goodness. 

So, I didn’t get much done with Cathy’s workshop, but I did get a lot of thoughts through, I didn’t get a lot of writing done, but definitely preparation for when I do write it, it was fabulous to have that dedicated time and I love Cathy, she’s so fabulous at what she does. So, it’s a lot of fun out there.

Austin: Man, you’ve really kind of painted the journey that people go through in this process, because I think at a high level, the idea of writing a book seems so simple, and obviously, we all know there’s a lot of writing in thought process and organizing of thoughts. I think everybody takes that almost for granted as it relates to the book, regardless of whether or not the reality and expectations are matched. But what you just described is this whole other personal growth component that goes along with writing the book, it’s a self-discovery journey because you have to really figure out what you think and feel, right?

Cindy: Right.

Taylorr: Yeah.

Austin: I think this is one of the benefits of writing in the first place. If it makes you get your thoughts out in a concrete way, this is actually what I think it’d feel, and it sounds like that can really be sort of an emotional rollercoaster at times.

Cindy: It definitely is. It’s cathartic, it’s beautiful, it’s freeing, a lot of authors will feel they’re freed and it’s wonderful when we can take our own stuff and this is where my passion comes from, is if I can take my stuff from what I went through with what I talk about on stage is depression, anxiety, suicidal planning, and use that as a story to share with other people and make a difference in their lives and give them a different perspective. 

The lessons that I’ve learned, what I do now, the processes I take, there’s just so much that we can construct, so many ways we can construct what we’ve been through and how we can teach others to do it differently and better and hopefully less painful, that it just makes what we go through more purposeful, more meaningful because that’s really hard stuff. We’ve been through trauma as professional speakers, as authors, as business owners, whatever we’re doing, running a company like Speaker Flow, most likely you’ve had some hardships; everybody’s had hardships in their life of some sort, maybe it’s not trauma, but it’s something else. 

And if we’re called to write a book about it or to speak about it, it’s a special responsibility that we have and we need to do it to the best possible and the highest caliber that we’re capable of doing. And that’s what’s really important in this whole process, and I don’t know that everybody, every ghostwriter, or book doctor, or author coach operates as I do, I’m very, I don’t know, I like the closeness that we have. I like to know, like when I opened up my author coaching program last year, what was important, for me, was that it was a small group of authors, it wasn’t a big everybody come to my author coaching program, but it’s just three to five authors and we get together, and we meet every week.

But what I did was I devised it so that it followed the same process I use for my individual ghostwriting authors. And I loved that because that was the part I didn’t want to lose when I coached was that intimacy, close relationship, so that I know what they need and they know how we’re going to do it and then I can recommend things, and so I really love that connection. Well, my company’s name is So Connected, so I love being connected to people.

Taylorr: Convenient. Yeah.

Cindy: Because it feeds my creativity, it feeds my ability to write better for them. So, that’s how I operate, that’s my internal process and the gifts that I’ve been given as a writer and person and, I guess creative.

Taylorr: Yeah. For sure

Cindy: Artist or writer, or whatever you would call me. So, yeah, that’s really, really important to me is that connection.

Austin: Yeah.

Taylorr: Yeah. As you were talking about this, I can imagine there’s some fear potentially that people might have about working with a ghostwriter, not maybe because they’re concerned maybe that it wouldn’t be as good or not, but maybe they’re not ready, maybe they’re not even prepared for the emotional journey. What are some of the fears that you come across with people who are interested in ghostwriting?

Cindy: It’s the same fears that we all have when we’re trying to do something new. So, we’re trying to build a new business, we’re trying to become a speaker, we’re trying out a new presentation, we’re working for a new client, we’re building whatever it is we want. And so, you’re fearful of the unknown. You’re fearful that what you, a lot of it is the same things, it’s imposter syndrome, it’s that negative self-talk, it’s the self-sabotage, it’s not understanding or not believing in yourself enough that you have something important to say. I’m halfway through books with people and they’re like, I don’t even know if anyone’s going to buy this book, I don’t know that it’s important. 

I’m like, what are you talking about? Of course, it’s important. First of all, I would never take a book on and an author on if I didn’t think what they had to say was important for the world to hear. And second of all, I’m like, look at what you’re giving us, it’s just incredible, right? What they’ve been through and they’re sharing and they’re being vulnerable and that’s the other part is like, how can I trust someone to work with me? How can I really be able to dig deep and go to the depths of the darkness I’ve been to? And that’s why, excuse me, I get really emotional about this stuff, because it’s emotional. 

That’s why it’s so important to find the right fit above all else. The right fit of who you’re going to work with and how you want to work is what’s most important. And so, you really have to meet a lot of ghostwriters or whoever you’re looking to work with and make sure that you’re aligned, that they’re going to be able to pull out of you what you are resistant to, and sometimes you’re so resistant you don’t even know it needs to be pulled out.

Austin: Yeah, man. That’s such great advice. I love how just real you are with this process. There are no sales tropes or anything and I know you’re not here to sell yourself, in fact, probably people are very lucky to even get on your calendar because I know that you are a very busy person with a lot of people vying for your attention. But you look at this process, well, and it’s not even just from a practical standpoint too, but I can tell that you really just like what you do, and you want to enjoy the process as well, it’s so important because it’s such an important thing for the people that are going through the process with you or with whoever it is that.

Cindy: It is, yeah.

Austin: I’m kind of curious because I really get the sense that, that intimacy that you get between you and your clients is important to you. And you’re a great person, I’m sure your clients love that as well. I mentioned that there are some people that do want to be more or less close to the project though. So, do you find that there are some clients that want to be more removed from it as opposed to being very inclined? Where’s the balance there?

Cindy: Well, I have a mix, I’m looking at my list of people I’m working with and it’s a mix. Some people are like, okay, I’ve given you the interviews, bring me back the chapters. And then some people are like, they want to be part of that drafting process, they want to see it at certain intervals and those types of things, or it’ll be like, if they’re uncertain of the tone they want, I just met with an author yesterday and I’m like, okay, so I’ve presented a couple of chapters to you. They were in a different tone, this tone and starting the book off this way is more in tune with your real voice, and it’s a little edgy, because she’s kind of straightforward. 

And I said, so it might be a little rough around the edges, so let’s see if you like this. And so, until we get that tone fixed, they want to be involved or I need them to be involved, and so when she read it, she’s like, oh my God, that’s exactly like me.

Taylorr: Mission accomplished.

Cindy: She said, I think you need to soften it a bit. So, there are ebbs and flows. So, some people are just like, write it and let me see it, the first couple chapters I’ll always run by them because I need to make sure we’re on the same page and everything. And then some people are just like, draft it, come back to me. And I try to do two or three chapters at a time before I give it back to them because it’s just better to keep going in flow. And sometimes they’re interrelated and you kind of want to know how it sequences and that’s usually, and then I’m in the flow, I’m not just stopping at the end of a chapter and going one-by-one. 

So, it’s a mix, it’s a mix and what it depends on is how available they are. If they’re off for summer and the book is their entire process, I’m hearing from them every week. Their entire priority, I’m hearing from them every week. If they are all over the world speaking or running their business or whatever they’re doing, I have to make the effort to get in touch with them and say, hey, this is when we’re meeting again. Because they want hands-off, they hired a ghostwriter, they’re paying a great investment for it and they want as little to do with it as possible. 

So, I have a whole range, so it all depends on, again, I try to be as flexible and flexible with the author as I can be, that’s what it’s about. So, it is, it’s definitely a yin and yang in how we come together and what works best for them.

Taylorr: For sure. Wow. I love that breakdown. And I think you’ve enlightened me of like, I kind of always imagined ghostwriting, I would need to come prepared with all of the things ready, to be like, here, this is the thing. But it sounds like it’s a lot about discovery and it’s an emotional journey and there are varying degrees of how involved you can be or not be, there’s so much variability in it and that’s super enlightening.

Cindy: Well, not all ghostwriters operate that way.

Taylorr: Sure.

Cindy: I know some ghostwriters are just black and white, this is how we go and this is what happens and we get a book at the end. That is not my style, I would not operate well like that, because, for me, evoking emotion out of the content and for the reader and even for the website, when I did website content and marketing content, it was all about grabbing people, keeping them engaged and evoking that emotion and evoking inspiration and keeping them reading along. And some people won’t like my style, I can think of a couple of people I know that would never, ever meld with me, and that’s why it’s about the best fit.

Taylorr: That’s right. No, I love that you’ve reinforced that throughout this. Thank you for sharing all your wisdom, I feel I’ve just learned so much about this process and I hope our listeners did too. Cindy, if they want to learn more about potentially working with you or even ghostwriting, writing their own book, do you have any resources you can point them towards, how do they get in touch with you?

Cindy: So, my website is under construction. It’s not at its best, mid-June come back, no. soconnectedllc.com is the name of the website and on there, there’s an invitation to download the checklist, the A-to-Z checklist in order to get kick-started with your book. It’s a 17-page guide of all the answers I’ve had to share with other authors who’ve asked me questions and it goes all the way from, what you do with your concept, to questions to ask your publisher and all the stuff in-between. So, that’s a really good piece. 

And then, I’m always here as a resource for your community and there’s also a way to schedule a call with me, a 30-minute call for questions. No sales, no pressure, all service, how I can help you, because I want you to get what you need as authors. And that’s the best way to get ahold of me is the website. If you want to email me, it’s [email protected], if you want a direct line. So, those would be the two best ways to reach us.

Taylorr: Alright. That is awesome. Rest in peace your inbox. So, you heard it right from the source you guys, actually, go check that guide out, it is thorough, it’s amazing, Austin and I have both seen it, it’s absolutely incredible. Definitely go check that out if you are thinking about writing a book as a very first step, it’s going to be a monumental resource. Cindy.

Cindy: Thank you.

Taylorr: Thank you so much for coming on the show today, this has been an absolute pleasure and, hey, listeners, if you liked this show, rate it, like it, subscribe to it and if you want more awesome resources like this, go to speakerflow.com/resources. Thank you so much for chiming in. I just wanted to take a second to thank our sponsor Auxbus. Auxbus is the all-in-one suite of tools you need to run your podcast, and it’s actually what we run here at SpeakerFlow for Technically Speaking. 

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